Name: Republic, Book IV
Author: Plato

Burnet (OCT, 1902) · Shorey (1930)

Shorey (1930)

419a Καὶ ὁ Ἀδείμαντος ὑπολαβών, Τί οὖν, ἔφη, ὦ Σώκρατες,

ἀπολογήσῃ, ἐάν τίς σε φῇ μὴ πάνυ τι εὐδαίμονας ποιεῖν

τούτους τοὺς ἄνδρας, καὶ ταῦτα δι' ἑαυτούς, ὧν ἔστι μὲν

ἡ πόλις τῇ ἀληθείᾳ, οἱ δὲ μηδὲν ἀπολαύουσιν ἀγαθὸν τῆς

πόλεως, οἷον ἄλλοι ἀγρούς τε κεκτημένοι καὶ οἰκίας οἰκοδομούμενοι

καλὰς καὶ μεγάλας, καὶ ταύταις πρέπουσαν κατασκευὴν

κτώμενοι, καὶ θυσίας θεοῖς ἰδίας θύοντες, καὶ ξενοδοκοῦντες,

καὶ δὴ καὶ ἃ νυνδὴ σὺ ἔλεγες, χρυσόν τε καὶ ἄργυρον κεκτημένοι

καὶ πάντα ὅσα νομίζεται τοῖς μέλλουσιν μακαρίοις

εἶναι; ἀλλ' ἀτεχνῶς, φαίη ἄν, ὥσπερ ἐπίκουροι μισθωτοὶ ἐν

420a τῇ πόλει φαίνονται καθῆσθαι οὐδὲν ἄλλο ἢ φρουροῦντες.

And Adeimantus broke in and said, What will be your defence, Socrates, if anyone objects that you are not making these men very happy, and that through their own fault? For the city really belongs to them and yet they get no enjoyment out of it as ordinary men do by owning lands and building fine big houses and providing them with suitable furniture and winning the favor of the gods by private sacrifices and entertaining guests and enjoying too those possessions which you just now spoke of, gold and silver and all that is customary for those who are expecting to be happy?
But they seem, one might say, to be established in idleness in the city, exactly like hired mercenaries, with nothing to do but keep guard.

Ναί, ἦν δ' ἐγώ, καὶ ταῦτά γε ἐπισίτιοι καὶ οὐδὲ μισθὸν

πρὸς τοῖς σιτίοις λαμβάνοντες ὥσπερ οἱ ἄλλοι, ὥστε οὐδ'

ἂν ἀποδημῆσαι βούλωνται ἰδίᾳ, ἐξέσται αὐτοῖς, οὐδ' ἑταίραις

διδόναι, οὐδ' ἀναλίσκειν ἄν ποι βούλωνται ἄλλοσε, οἷα δὴ

οἱ εὐδαίμονες δοκοῦντες εἶναι ἀναλίσκουσι. ταῦτα καὶ ἄλλα

τοιαῦτα συχνὰ τῆς κατηγορίας ἀπολείπεις.

Yes, said I, and what is more, they serve for board-wages and do not even receive pay in addition to their food as others do, so that they will not even be able to take a journey on their own account, if they wish to, or make presents to their mistresses, or spend money in other directions according to their desires like the men who are thought to be happy. These and many similar counts of the indictment you are omitting.

Ἀλλ', ἦ δ' ὅς, ἔστω καὶ ταῦτα κατηγορημένα.

Well, said he, assume these counts too.

420b Τί οὖν δὴ ἀπολογησόμεθα, φῄς;

What then will be our apology you ask?

Ναί.

Yes.

Τὸν αὐτὸν οἶμον, ἦν δ' ἐγώ, πορευόμενοι εὑρήσομεν, ὡς

ἐγᾦμαι, ἃ λεκτέα. ἐροῦμεν γὰρ ὅτι θαυμαστὸν μὲν ἂν

οὐδὲν εἴη εἰ καὶ οὗτοι οὕτως εὐδαιμονέστατοί εἰσιν, οὐ

μὴν πρὸς τοῦτο βλέποντες τὴν πόλιν οἰκίζομεν, ὅπως ἕν

τι ἡμῖν ἔθνος ἔσται διαφερόντως εὔδαιμον, ἀλλ' ὅπως ὅτι

μάλιστα ὅλη ἡ πόλις. ᾠήθημεν γὰρ ἐν τῇ τοιαύτῃ μάλιστα

ἂν εὑρεῖν δικαιοσύνην καὶ αὖ ἐν τῇ κάκιστα οἰκουμένῃ

420c ἀδικίαν, κατιδόντες δὲ κρῖναι ἂν ὃ πάλαι ζητοῦμεν. νῦν

μὲν οὖν, ὡς οἰόμεθα, τὴν εὐδαίμονα πλάττομεν οὐκ ἀπολαβόντες

ὀλίγους ἐν αὐτῇ τοιούτους τινὰς τιθέντες, ἀλλ'

ὅλην· αὐτίκα δὲ τὴν ἐναντίαν σκεψόμεθα. ὥσπερ οὖν

ἂν εἰ ἡμᾶς ἀνδριάντα γράφοντας προσελθών τις ἔψεγε

λέγων ὅτι οὐ τοῖς καλλίστοις τοῦ ζῴου τὰ κάλλιστα φάρμακα

προστίθεμεν—οἱ γὰρ ὀφθαλμοὶ κάλλιστον ὂν οὐκ

ὀστρείῳ ἐναληλιμμένοι εἶεν ἀλλὰ μέλανι—μετρίως ἂν ἐδοκοῦμεν

420d πρὸς αὐτὸν ἀπολογεῖσθαι λέγοντες· "Ὦ θαυμάσιε,

μὴ οἴου δεῖν ἡμᾶς οὕτω καλοὺς ὀφθαλμοὺς γράφειν, ὥστε

μηδὲ ὀφθαλμοὺς φαίνεσθαι, μηδ' αὖ τἆλλα μέρη, ἀλλ'

ἄθρει εἰ τὰ προσήκοντα ἑκάστοις ἀποδιδόντες τὸ ὅλον

καλὸν ποιοῦμεν· καὶ δὴ καὶ νῦν μὴ ἀνάγκαζε ἡμᾶς τοιαύτην

εὐδαιμονίαν τοῖς φύλαξι προσάπτειν, ἣ ἐκείνους πᾶν μᾶλλον

420e ἀπεργάσεται ἢ φύλακας. ἐπιστάμεθα γὰρ καὶ τοὺς γεωργοὺς

ξυστίδας ἀμφιέσαντες καὶ χρυσὸν περιθέντες πρὸς

ἡδονὴν ἐργάζεσθαι κελεύειν τὴν γῆν, καὶ τοὺς κεραμέας

κατακλίναντες ἐπὶ δεξιὰ πρὸς τὸ πῦρ διαπίνοντάς τε καὶ

εὐωχουμένους, τὸν τροχὸν παραθεμένους, ὅσον ἂν ἐπιθυμῶσι

κεραμεύειν, καὶ τοὺς ἄλλους πάντας τοιούτῳ τρόπῳ μακαρίους

ποιεῖν, ἵνα δὴ ὅλη ἡ πόλις εὐδαιμονῇ. ἀλλ' ἡμᾶς μὴ οὕτω

νουθέτει· ὡς, ἄν σοι πειθώμεθα, οὔτε ὁ γεωργὸς γεωργὸς

421a ἔσται οὔτε ὁ κεραμεὺς κεραμεὺς οὔτε ἄλλος οὐδεὶς οὐδὲν

ἔχων σχῆμα ἐξ ὧν πόλις γίγνεται. ἀλλὰ τῶν μὲν ἄλλων

ἐλάττων λόγος· νευρορράφοι γὰρ φαῦλοι γενόμενοι καὶ

διαφθαρέντες καὶ προσποιησάμενοι εἶναι μὴ ὄντες πόλει

οὐδὲν δεινόν, φύλακες δὲ νόμων τε καὶ πόλεως μὴ ὄντες

ἀλλὰ δοκοῦντες ὁρᾷς δὴ ὅτι πᾶσαν ἄρδην πόλιν ἀπολλύασιν,

καὶ αὖ τοῦ εὖ οἰκεῖν καὶ εὐδαιμονεῖν μόνοι τὸν καιρὸν

ἔχουσιν." εἰ μὲν οὖν ἡμεῖς μὲν φύλακας ὡς ἀληθῶς

421b ποιοῦμεν ἥκιστα κακούργους τῆς πόλεως, ὁ δ' ἐκεῖνο λέγων

γεωργούς τινας καὶ ὥσπερ ἐν πανηγύρει ἀλλ' οὐκ ἐν πόλει

ἑστιάτορας εὐδαίμονας, ἄλλο ἄν τι ἢ πόλιν λέγοι. σκεπτέον

οὖν πότερον πρὸς τοῦτο βλέποντες τοὺς φύλακας καθιστῶμεν,

ὅπως ὅτι πλείστη αὐτοῖς εὐδαιμονία ἐγγενήσεται,

ἢ τοῦτο μὲν εἰς τὴν πόλιν ὅλην βλέποντας θεατέον εἰ

ἐκείνῃ ἐγγίγνεται, τοὺς δ' ἐπικούρους τούτους καὶ τοὺς

421c φύλακας ἐκεῖνο ἀναγκαστέον ποιεῖν καὶ πειστέον, ὅπως ὅτι

ἄριστοι δημιουργοὶ τοῦ ἑαυτῶν ἔργου ἔσονται, καὶ τοὺς

ἄλλους ἅπαντας ὡσαύτως, καὶ οὕτω συμπάσης τῆς πόλεως

αὐξανομένης καὶ καλῶς οἰκιζομένης ἐατέον ὅπως ἑκάστοις

τοῖς ἔθνεσιν ἡ φύσις ἀποδίδωσι τοῦ μεταλαμβάνειν εὐδαιμονίας.

By following the same path I think we shall find what to reply. For we shall say that while it would not surprise us if these men thus living prove to be the most happy, yet the object on which we fixed our eyes in the establishment of our state was not the exceptional happiness of any one class but the greatest possible happiness of the city as a whole. For we thought that in a state so constituted we should be most likely to discover justice as we should injustice in the worst governed state, and that when we had made these out we could pass judgement on the issue of our long inquiry. Our first task then, we take it, is to mold the model of a happy state—we are not isolating a small class in it and postulating their happiness, but that of the city as a whole. But the opposite type of state we will consider presently. It is as if we were coloring a statue and someone approached and censured us, saying that we did not apply the most beautiful pigments to the most beautiful parts of the image, since the eyes, which are the most beautiful part, have not been painted with purple but with black— we should think it a reasonable justification to reply, Don’t expect us, quaint friend, to paint the eyes so fine that they will not be like eyes at all, nor the other parts. But observe whether by assigning what is proper to each we render the whole beautiful. And so in the present case you must not require us to attach to the guardians a happiness that will make them anything but guardians. For in like manner we could clothe the farmers in robes of state and deck them with gold and bid them cultivate the soil at their pleasure, and we could make the potters recline on couches from left to right before the fire drinking toasts and feasting with their wheel alongside to potter with when they are so disposed, and we can make all the others happy in the same fashion, so that thus the entire city may be happy.
But urge us not to this, since, if we yield, the farmer will not be a farmer nor the potter a potter, nor will any other of the types that constitute state keep its form. However, for the others it matters less. For cobblers who deteriorate and are spoiled and pretend to be the workmen that they are not are no great danger to a state. But guardians of laws and of the city who are not what they pretend to be, but only seem, destroy utterly, I would have you note, the entire state, and on the other hand, they alone are decisive of its good government and happiness. If then we are forming true guardians and keepers of our liberties, men least likely to harm the commonwealth, but the proponent of the other ideal is thinking of farmers and happy feasters as it were in a festival and not in a civic community, he would have something else in mind than a state. Consider, then, whether our aim in establishing the guardians is the greatest possible happiness among them or whether that is something we must look to see develop in the city as a whole, but these helpers and guardians are to be constrained and persuaded to do what will make them the best craftsmen in their own work, and similarly all the rest. And so, as the entire city develops and is ordered well, each class is to be left, to the share of happiness that its nature comports.

Ἀλλ', ἦ δ' ὅς, καλῶς μοι δοκεῖς λέγειν.

Well, he said, I think you are right.

Ἆρ' οὖν, ἦν δ' ἐγώ, καὶ τὸ τούτου ἀδελφὸν δόξω σοι

μετρίως λέγειν;

And will you then, I said, also think me reasonable in another point akin to this?

Τί μάλιστα;

What pray?

421d Τοὺς ἄλλους αὖ δημιουργοὺς σκόπει εἰ τάδε διαφθείρει,

ὥστε καὶ κακοὺς γίγνεσθαι.

Consider whether these are the causes that corrupt other craftsmen too so as positively to spoil them.

Τὰ ποῖα δὴ ταῦτα;

What causes?

Πλοῦτος, ἦν δ' ἐγώ, καὶ πενία.

Wealth and poverty, said I.

Πῶς δή;

How so? Thus!

Ὧδε. πλουτήσας χυτρεὺς δοκεῖ σοι ἔτ' ἐθελήσειν ἐπιμελεῖσθαι

τῆς τέχνης;

do you think a potter who grew rich would any longer be willing to give his mind to his craft?

Οὐδαμῶς, ἔφη.

By no means, said he.

Ἀργὸς δὲ καὶ ἀμελὴς γενήσεται μᾶλλον αὐτὸς αὑτοῦ;

But will he become more idle and negligent than he was?

Πολύ γε.

Far more.

Οὐκοῦν κακίων χυτρεὺς γίγνεται;

Then he becomes a worse potter?

Καὶ τοῦτο, ἔφη, πολύ.

Far worse too.

Καὶ μὴν καὶ ὄργανά γε μὴ ἔχων παρέχεσθαι ὑπὸ πενίας

ἤ τι ἄλλο τῶν εἰς τὴν τέχνην τά τε ἔργα πονηρότερα

421e ἐργάσεται καὶ τοὺς ὑεῖς ἢ ἄλλους οὓς ἂν διδάσκῃ χείρους

δημιουργοὺς διδάξεται.

And yet again, if from poverty he is unable to provide himself with tools and other requirements of his art, the work that he turns out will be worse, and he will also make inferior workmen of his sons or any others whom he teaches.

Πῶς δ' οὔ;

Of course.

Ὑπ' ἀμφοτέρων δή, πενίας τε καὶ πλούτου, χείρω μὲν

τὰ τῶν τεχνῶν ἔργα, χείρους δὲ αὐτοί.

From both causes, then, poverty and wealth, the products of the arts deteriorate, and so do the artisans?

Φαίνεται.

So it appears.

Ἕτερα δή, ὡς ἔοικε, τοῖς φύλαξιν ηὑρήκαμεν, ἃ παντὶ τρόπῳ

φυλακτέον ὅπως μήποτε αὐτοὺς λήσει εἰς τὴν πόλιν παραδύντα.

Here, then, is a second group of things it seems that our guardians must guard against and do all in their power to keep from slipping into the city without their knowledge.

Τὰ ποῖα ταῦτα;

What are they?

422a Πλοῦτός τε, ἦν δ' ἐγώ, καὶ πενία· ὡς τοῦ μὲν τρυφὴν

καὶ ἀργίαν καὶ νεωτερισμὸν ἐμποιοῦντος, τῆς δὲ ἀνελευθερίαν

καὶ κακοεργίαν πρὸς τῷ νεωτερισμῷ.

Wealth and poverty, said I, since the one brings luxury, idleness and innovation, and the other illiberality and the evil of bad workmanship in addition to innovation.

Πάνυ μὲν οὖν, ἔφη. τόδε μέντοι, ὦ Σώκρατες, σκόπει,

πῶς ἡμῖν ἡ πόλις οἵα τ' ἔσται πολεμεῖν, ἐπειδὰν χρήματα

μὴ κεκτημένη ᾖ, ἄλλως τε κἂν πρὸς μεγάλην τε καὶ

πλουσίαν ἀναγκασθῇ πολεμεῖν.

Assuredly, he said; yet here is a point for your consideration, Socrates, how our city, possessing no wealth, will be able to wage war, especially if compelled to fight a large and wealthy state.

Δῆλον, ἦν δ' ἐγώ, ὅτι πρὸς μὲν μίαν χαλεπώτερον,

422b πρὸς δὲ δύο τοιαύτας ῥᾷον.

Obviously, said I, it would be rather difficult to fight one such,

Πῶς εἶπες; ἦ δ' ὅς.

but easier to fight two. What did you mean by that? he said.

Πρῶτον μέν που, εἶπον, ἐὰν δέῃ μάχεσθαι, ἆρα οὐ

πλουσίοις ἀνδράσι μαχοῦνται αὐτοὶ ὄντες πολέμου ἀθληταί;

Tell me first, I said, whether, if they have to fight, they will not be fighting as athletes of war against men of wealth?

Ναὶ τοῦτό γε, ἔφη.

Yes, that is true, he said.

Τί οὖν, ἦν δ' ἐγώ, ὦ Ἀδείμαντε; εἷς πύκτης ὡς οἷόν

τε κάλλιστα ἐπὶ τοῦτο παρεσκευασμένος δυοῖν μὴ πύκταιν,

πλουσίοιν δὲ καὶ πιόνοιν, οὐκ ἂν δοκεῖ σοι ῥᾳδίως μάχεσθαι;

Answer me then, Adeimantus. Do you not think that one boxer perfectly trained in the art could easily fight two fat rich men who knew nothing of it?

Οὐκ ἂν ἴσως, ἔφη, ἅμα γε.

Not at the same time perhaps, said he.

Οὐδ' εἰ ἐξείη, ἦν δ' ἐγώ, ὑποφεύγοντι τὸν πρότερον ἀεὶ

422c προσφερόμενον ἀναστρέφοντα κρούειν, καὶ τοῦτο ποιοῖ πολλάκις

ἐν ἡλίῳ τε καὶ πνίγει; ἆρά γε οὐ καὶ πλείους

χειρώσαιτ' ἂν τοιούτους ὁ τοιοῦτος;

Not even, said I, if he were allowed to retreat and then turn and strike the one who came up first, and if he repeated the procedure many times under a burning and stifling sun? Would not such a fighter down even a number of such opponents?

Ἀμέλει, ἔφη, οὐδὲν ἂν γένοιτο θαυμαστόν.

Doubtless, he said; it wouldn’t be surprising if he did.

Ἀλλ' οὐκ οἴει πυκτικῆς πλέον μετέχειν τοὺς πλουσίους

ἐπιστήμῃ τε καὶ ἐμπειρίᾳ ἢ πολεμικῆς;

Well, don’t you think that the rich have more of the skill and practice of boxing than of the art of war?

Ἔγωγ', ἔφη.

I do, he said.

Ῥᾳδίως ἄρα ἡμῖν οἱ ἀθληταὶ ἐκ τῶν εἰκότων διπλασίοις

τε καὶ τριπλασίοις αὑτῶν μαχοῦνται.

It will be easy, then, for our athletes in all probability to fight with double and triple their number.

Συγχωρήσομαί σοι, ἔφη· δοκεῖς γάρ μοι ὀρθῶς λέγειν.

I shall have to concede the point, he said, for I believe you are right.

422d Τί δ' ἂν πρεσβείαν πέμψαντες εἰς τὴν ἑτέραν πόλιν

τἀληθῆ εἴπωσιν, ὅτι "Ἡμεῖς μὲν οὐδὲν χρυσίῳ οὐδ'

ἀργυρίῳ χρώμεθα, οὐδ' ἡμῖν θέμις, ὑμῖν δέ· συμπολεμήσαντες

οὖν μεθ' ἡμῶν ἔχετε τὰ τῶν ἑτέρων;" οἴει τινὰς

ἀκούσαντας ταῦτα αἱρήσεσθαι κυσὶ πολεμεῖν στερεοῖς τε

καὶ ἰσχνοῖς μᾶλλον ἢ μετὰ κυνῶν προβάτοις πίοσί τε καὶ

ἁπαλοῖς;

Well then, if they send an embassy to the other city and say what is in fact true: We make no use of gold and silver nor is it lawful for us but it is for you: do you then join us in the war and keep the spoils of the enemy,—do you suppose any who heard such a proposal would choose to fight against hard and wiry hounds rather than with the aid of the hounds against fat and tender sheep? I think not.

Οὔ μοι δοκεῖ. ἀλλ' ἐὰν εἰς μίαν, ἔφη, πόλιν συναθροισθῇ

422e τὰ τῶν ἄλλων χρήματα, ὅρα μὴ κίνδυνον φέρῃ

τῇ μὴ πλουτούσῃ.

Yet consider whether the accumulation of all the wealth of other cities in one does not involve danger for the state that has no wealth.

Εὐδαίμων εἶ, ἦν δ' ἐγώ, ὅτι οἴει ἄξιον εἶναι ἄλλην τινὰ

προσειπεῖν πόλιν ἢ τὴν τοιαύτην οἵαν ἡμεῖς κατεσκευάζομεν.

What happy innocence, said I, to suppose that you can properly use the name city of any other than the one we are constructing.

Ἀλλὰ τί μήν; ἔφη.

Why, what should we say? he said.

Μειζόνως, ἦν δ' ἐγώ, χρὴ προσαγορεύειν τὰς ἄλλας·

ἑκάστη γὰρ αὐτῶν πόλεις εἰσὶ πάμπολλαι ἀλλ' οὐ πόλις,

τὸ τῶν παιζόντων. δύο μέν, κἂν ὁτιοῦν ᾖ, πολεμία ἀλλήλαις,

423a ἡ μὲν πενήτων, ἡ δὲ πλουσίων· τούτων δ' ἐν ἑκατέρᾳ

πάνυ πολλαί, αἷς ἐὰν μὲν ὡς μιᾷ προσφέρῃ, παντὸς ἂν

ἁμάρτοις, ἐὰν δὲ ὡς πολλαῖς, διδοὺς τὰ τῶν ἑτέρων τοῖς

ἑτέροις χρήματά τε καὶ δυνάμεις ἢ καὶ αὐτούς, συμμάχοις

μὲν ἀεὶ πολλοῖς χρήσῃ, πολεμίοις δ' ὀλίγοις. καὶ ἕως ἂν

ἡ πόλις σοι οἰκῇ σωφρόνως ὡς ἄρτι ἐτάχθη, μεγίστη ἔσται,

οὐ τῷ εὐδοκιμεῖν λέγω, ἀλλ' ὡς ἀληθῶς μεγίστη, καὶ ἐὰν

μόνον ᾖ χιλίων τῶν προπολεμούντων· οὕτω γὰρ μεγάλην

πόλιν μίαν οὐ ῥᾳδίως οὔτε ἐν Ἕλλησιν οὔτε ἐν βαρβάροις

423b εὑρήσεις, δοκούσας δὲ πολλὰς καὶ πολλαπλασίας τῆς

τηλικαύτης. ἢ ἄλλως οἴει;

A greater predication, said I, must be applied to the others. For they are each one of them many cities, not a city, as it goes in the game.
There are two at the least at enmity with one another, the city of the rich and the city of the poor, and in each of these there are many. If you deal with them as one you will altogether miss the mark, but if you treat them as a multiplicity by offering to the one faction the property, the power, the very persons of the other, you will continue always to have few enemies and many allies. And so long as your city is governed soberly in the order just laid down, it will be the greatest of cities. I do not mean greatest in repute, but in reality, even though it have only a thousand defenders. For a city of this size that is really one you will not easily discover either among Greeks or barbarians—but of those that seem so you will find many and many times the size of this. Or do you think otherwise?

Οὐ μὰ τὸν Δί', ἔφη.

No, indeed I don’t, said he.

Οὐκοῦν, ἦν δ' ἐγώ, οὗτος ἂν εἴη καὶ κάλλιστος ὅρος

τοῖς ἡμετέροις ἄρχουσιν, ὅσην δεῖ τὸ μέγεθος τὴν πόλιν

ποιεῖσθαι καὶ ἡλίκῃ οὔσῃ ὅσην χώραν ἀφορισαμένους τὴν

ἄλλην χαίρειν ἐᾶν.

Would not this, then, be the best rule and measure for our governors of the proper size of the city and of the territory that they should mark off for a city of that size and seek no more?

Τίς, ἔφη, ὅρος;

What is the measure?

Οἶμαι μέν, ἦν δ' ἐγώ, τόνδε· μέχρι οὗ ἂν ἐθέλῃ αὐξομένη

εἶναι μία, μέχρι τούτου αὔξειν, πέρα δὲ μή.

I think, said I, that they should let it grow so long as in its growth it consents to remain a unity, but no further.

423c Καὶ καλῶς γ', ἔφη.

Excellent, he said.

Οὐκοῦν καὶ τοῦτο αὖ ἄλλο πρόσταγμα τοῖς φύλαξι

προστάξομεν, φυλάττειν παντὶ τρόπῳ ὅπως μήτε σμικρὰ ἡ

πόλις ἔσται μήτε μεγάλη δοκοῦσα, ἀλλά τις ἱκανὴ καὶ μία.

Then is not this still another injunction that we should lay upon our guardians, to keep guard in every way that the city shall not be too small, nor great only in seeming, but that it shall be a sufficient city and one?

Καὶ φαῦλόν γ', ἔφη, ἴσως αὐτοῖς προστάξομεν.

That behest will perhaps be an easy one for them, he said.

Καὶ τούτου γε, ἦν δ' ἐγώ, ἔτι φαυλότερον τόδε, οὗ καὶ

ἐν τῷ πρόσθεν ἐπεμνήσθημεν λέγοντες ὡς δέοι, ἐάντε τῶν

φυλάκων τις φαῦλος ἔκγονος γένηται, εἰς τοὺς ἄλλους

423d αὐτὸν ἀποπέμπεσθαι, ἐάντ' ἐκ τῶν ἄλλων σπουδαῖος, εἰς

τοὺς φύλακας. τοῦτο δ' ἐβούλετο δηλοῦν ὅτι καὶ τοὺς

ἄλλους πολίτας, πρὸς ὅ τις πέφυκεν, πρὸς τοῦτο ἕνα πρὸς

ἓν ἕκαστον ἔργον δεῖ κομίζειν, ὅπως ἂν ἓν τὸ αὑτοῦ ἐπιτηδεύων

ἕκαστος μὴ πολλοὶ ἀλλ' εἷς γίγνηται, καὶ οὕτω δὴ

σύμπασα ἡ πόλις μία φύηται ἀλλὰ μὴ πολλαί.

And still easier, haply, I said, is this that we mentioned before when we said that if a degenerate offspring was born to the guardians he must be sent away to the other classes, and likewise if a superior to the others he must be enrolled among the guardians; and the purport of all this was that the other citizens too must be sent to the task for which their natures were fitted, one man to one work, in order that each of them fulfilling his own function may be not many men, but one, and so the entire city may come to be not a multiplicity but a unity.

Ἔστι γάρ, ἔφη, τοῦτο ἐκείνου σμικρότερον.

Why yes, he said, this is even more trifling than that.

Οὔτοι, ἦν δ' ἐγώ, ὦ ἀγαθὲ Ἀδείμαντε, ὡς δόξειεν ἄν

τις, ταῦτα πολλὰ καὶ μεγάλα αὐτοῖς προστάττομεν ἀλλὰ

423e πάντα φαῦλα, ἐὰν τὸ λεγόμενον ἓν μέγα φυλάττωσι,

μᾶλλον δ' ἀντὶ μεγάλου ἱκανόν.

These are not, my good Adeimantus, as one might suppose, numerous and difficult injunctions that we are imposing upon them, but they are all easy, provided they guard, as the saying is, the one great thing—or instead of great let us call it sufficient.

Τί τοῦτο; ἔφη.

What is that? he said.

Τὴν παιδείαν, ἦν δ' ἐγώ, καὶ τροφήν· ἐὰν γὰρ εὖ παιδευόμενοι

μέτριοι ἄνδρες γίγνωνται, πάντα ταῦτα ῥᾳδίως

διόψονται, καὶ ἄλλα γε ὅσα νῦν ἡμεῖς παραλείπομεν, τήν

τε τῶν γυναικῶν κτῆσιν καὶ γάμων καὶ παιδοποιίας, ὅτι

424a δεῖ ταῦτα κατὰ τὴν παροιμίαν πάντα ὅτι μάλιστα κοινὰ τὰ

φίλων ποιεῖσθαι.

Their education and nurture, I replied. For if a right education makes of them reasonable men they will easily discover everything of this kind—and other principles that we now pass over, as that the possession of wives and marriage, and the procreation of children and all that sort of thing should be made as far as possible the proverbial goods of friends that are common.

Ὀρθότατα γάρ, ἔφη, γίγνοιτ' ἄν.

Yes, that would be the best way, he said.

Καὶ μήν, εἶπον, πολιτεία ἐάνπερ ἅπαξ ὁρμήσῃ εὖ,

ἔρχεται ὥσπερ κύκλος αὐξανομένη· τροφὴ γὰρ καὶ παίδευσις

χρηστὴ σῳζομένη φύσεις ἀγαθὰς ἐμποιεῖ, καὶ αὖ

φύσεις χρησταὶ τοιαύτης παιδείας ἀντιλαμβανόμεναι ἔτι

βελτίους τῶν προτέρων φύονται, εἴς τε τἆλλα καὶ εἰς τὸ

424b γεννᾶν, ὥσπερ καὶ ἐν τοῖς ἄλλοις ζῴοις.

And, moreover, said I, the state, if it once starts well, proceeds as it were in a cycle of growth. I mean that a sound nurture and education if kept up creates good natures in the state, and sound natures in turn receiving an education of this sort develop into better men than their predecessors both for other purposes and for the production of offspring as among animals also.

Εἰκός γ', ἔφη.

It is probable, he said.

Ὡς τοίνυν διὰ βραχέων εἰπεῖν, τούτου ἀνθεκτέον τοῖς

ἐπιμεληταῖς τῆς πόλεως, ὅπως ἂν αὐτοὺς μὴ λάθῃ διαφθαρὲν

ἀλλὰ παρὰ πάντα αὐτὸ φυλάττωσι, τὸ μὴ νεωτερίζειν περὶ

γυμναστικήν τε καὶ μουσικὴν παρὰ τὴν τάξιν, ἀλλ' ὡς

οἷόν τε μάλιστα φυλάττειν, φοβουμένους ὅταν τις λέγῃ

ὡς τὴν

ἀοιδὴν μᾶλλον ἐπιφρονέουσ' ἄνθρωποι,

ἥτις ἀειδόντεσσι νεωτάτη ἀμφιπέληται,

424c μὴ πολλάκις τὸν ποιητήν τις οἴηται λέγειν οὐκ ᾄσματα νέα

ἀλλὰ τρόπον ᾠδῆς νέον, καὶ τοῦτο ἐπαινῇ. δεῖ δ' οὔτ'

ἐπαινεῖν τὸ τοιοῦτον οὔτε ὑπολαμβάνειν. εἶδος γὰρ καινὸν

μουσικῆς μεταβάλλειν εὐλαβητέον ὡς ἐν ὅλῳ κινδυνεύοντα·

οὐδαμοῦ γὰρ κινοῦνται μουσικῆς τρόποι ἄνευ πολιτικῶν

νόμων τῶν μεγίστων, ὥς φησί τε Δάμων καὶ ἐγὼ πείθομαι.

To put it briefly, then, said I, it is to this that the overseers of our state must cleave and be watchful against its insensible corruption. They must throughout be watchful against innovations in music and gymnastics counter to the established order, and to the best of their power guard against them, fearing when anyone says that That song is most regarded among men Which hovers newest on the singer’s lips, Hom. Od. 1.351 lest haply it be supposed that the poet means not new songs but a new way of song and is commending this. But we must not praise that sort of thing nor conceive it to be the poet’s meaning. For a change to a new type of music is something to beware of as a hazard of all our fortunes. For the modes of music are never disturbed without unsettling of the most fundamental political and social conventions, as Damon affirms and as I am convinced.

Καὶ ἐμὲ τοίνυν, ἔφη ὁ Ἀδείμαντος, θὲς τῶν πεπεισμένων.

Set me too down in the number of the convinced, said Adeimantus.

424d Τὸ δὴ φυλακτήριον, ἦν δ' ἐγώ, ὡς ἔοικεν, ἐνταῦθά που

οἰκοδομητέον τοῖς φύλαξιν, ἐν μουσικῇ.

It is here, then, I said, in music, as it seems, that our guardians must build their guard-house and post of watch.

Ἡ γοῦν παρανομία, ἔφη, ῥᾳδίως αὕτη λανθάνει παραδυομένη.

It is certain, he said, that this is the kind of lawlessness that easily insinuates itself unobserved.

Ναί, ἔφην, ὡς ἐν παιδιᾶς γε μέρει καὶ ὡς κακὸν οὐδὲν

ἐργαζομένη.

Yes, said I, because it is supposed to be only a form of play and to work no harm.

Οὐδὲ γὰρ ἐργάζεται, ἔφη, ἄλλο γε ἢ κατὰ σμικρὸν

εἰσοικισαμένη ἠρέμα ὑπορρεῖ πρὸς τὰ ἤθη τε καὶ τὰ ἐπιτηδεύματα·

ἐκ δὲ τούτων εἰς τὰ πρὸς ἀλλήλους συμβόλαια

μείζων ἐκβαίνει, ἐκ δὲ δὴ τῶν συμβολαίων ἔρχεται ἐπὶ

424e τοὺς νόμους καὶ πολιτείας σὺν πολλῇ, ὦ Σώκρατες, ἀσελγείᾳ,

ἕως ἂν τελευτῶσα πάντα ἰδίᾳ καὶ δημοσίᾳ ἀνατρέψῃ.

Nor does it work any, he said, except that by gradual infiltration it softly overflows upon the characters and pursuits of men and from these issues forth grown greater to attack their business dealings, and from these relations it proceeds against the laws and the constitution with wanton licence, Socrates, till finally it overthrows all things public and private.

Εἶεν, ἦν δ' ἐγώ· οὕτω τοῦτ' ἔχει;

Well, said I, are these things so?

Δοκεῖ μοι, ἔφη.

I think so, he said.

Οὐκοῦν, ὃ ἐξ ἀρχῆς ἐλέγομεν, τοῖς ἡμετέροις παισὶν

ἐννομωτέρου εὐθὺς παιδιᾶς μεθεκτέον, ὡς παρανόμου γιγνομένης

αὐτῆς καὶ παίδων τοιούτων ἐννόμους τε καὶ σπουδαίους

425a ἐξ αὐτῶν ἄνδρας αὐξάνεσθαι ἀδύνατον ὄν;

Then, as we were saying in the beginning, our youth must join in a more law-abiding play, since, if play grows lawless and the children likewise, it is impossible that they should grow up to be men of serious temper and lawful spirit.

Πῶς δ' οὐχί; ἔφη.

Of course, he said.

Ὅταν δὴ ἄρα καλῶς ἀρξάμενοι παῖδες παίζειν εὐνομίαν

διὰ τῆς μουσικῆς εἰσδέξωνται, πάλιν τοὐναντίον ἢ 'κείνοις

εἰς πάντα συνέπεταί τε καὶ αὔξει, ἐπανορθοῦσα εἴ τι καὶ

πρότερον τῆς πόλεως ἔκειτο.

And so we may reason that when children in their earliest play are imbued with the spirit of law and order through their music, the opposite of the former supposition happens—this spirit waits upon them in all things and fosters their growth, and restores and sets up again whatever was overthrown in the other type of state.

Ἀληθῆ μέντοι, ἔφη.

True, indeed, he said.

Καὶ τὰ σμικρὰ ἄρα, εἶπον, δοκοῦντα εἶναι νόμιμα

ἐξευρίσκουσιν οὗτοι, ἃ οἱ πρότερον ἀπώλλυσαν πάντα.

Then such men rediscover for themselves those seemingly trifling conventions which their predecessors abolished altogether.

<Τὰ> ποῖα;

Of what sort?

425b Τὰ τοιάδε· σιγάς τε τῶν νεωτέρων παρὰ πρεσβυτέροις

ἃς πρέπει, καὶ κατακλίσεις καὶ ὑπαναστάσεις καὶ γονέων

θεραπείας, καὶ κουράς γε καὶ ἀμπεχόνας καὶ ὑποδέσεις καὶ

ὅλον τὸν τοῦ σώματος σχηματισμὸν καὶ τἆλλα ὅσα τοιαῦτα.

ἢ οὐκ οἴει;

Such things as the becoming silence of the young in the presence of their elders; the giving place to them and rising up before them, and dutiful service of parents, and the cut of the hair and the garments and the fashion of the foot-gear, and in general the deportment of the body and everything of the kind. Don’t you think so?

Ἔγωγε.

I do.

Νομοθετεῖν δ' αὐτὰ οἶμαι εὔηθες· οὔτε γάρ που γίγνεται

οὔτ' ἂν μείνειεν λόγῳ τε καὶ γράμμασιν νομοθετηθέντα.

Yet to enact them into laws would, I think, be silly. For such laws are not obeyed nor would they last, being enacted only in words and on paper.

Πῶς γάρ;

How could they?

Κινδυνεύει γοῦν, ἦν δ' ἐγώ, ὦ Ἀδείμαντε, ἐκ τῆς παιδείας

425c ὅποι ἄν τις ὁρμήσῃ, τοιαῦτα καὶ τὰ ἑπόμενα εἶναι.

ἢ οὐκ ἀεὶ τὸ ὅμοιον ὂν ὅμοιον παρακαλεῖ;

At any rate, Adeimantus, I said, the direction of the education from whence one starts is likely to determine the quality of what follows. Does not like ever summon like?

Τί μήν;

Surely.

Καὶ τελευτῶν δὴ οἶμαι φαῖμεν ἂν εἰς ἕν τι τέλεον καὶ

νεανικὸν ἀποβαίνειν αὐτὸ ἢ ἀγαθὸν ἢ καὶ τοὐναντίον.

And the final outcome, I presume, we would say is one complete and vigorous product of good or the reverse.

Τί γὰρ οὔκ; ἦ δ' ὅς.

Of course, said he.

Ἐγὼ μὲν τοίνυν, εἶπον, διὰ ταῦτα οὐκ ἂν ἔτι τὰ τοιαῦτα

ἐπιχειρήσαιμι νομοθετεῖν.

For my part, then, I said, for these reasons I would not go on to try to legislate on such matters.

Εἰκότως γ', ἔφη.

With good reason, said he.

Τί δέ, ὦ πρὸς θεῶν, ἔφην, τάδε τὰ ἀγοραῖα, συμβολαίων

τε πέρι κατ' ἀγορὰν ἕκαστοι ἃ πρὸς ἀλλήλους συμβάλλουσιν,

425d εἰ δὲ βούλει, καὶ χειροτεχνικῶν περὶ συμβολαίων

καὶ λοιδοριῶν καὶ αἰκίας καὶ δικῶν λήξεως καὶ δικαστῶν

καταστάσεως, καὶ εἴ που τελῶν τινες ἢ πράξεις ἢ θέσεις

ἀναγκαῖοί εἰσιν ἢ κατ' ἀγορὰς ἢ λιμένας, ἢ καὶ τὸ παράπαν

ἀγορανομικὰ ἄττα ἢ ἀστυνομικὰ ἢ ἐλλιμενικὰ ἢ ὅσα ἄλλα

τοιαῦτα, τούτων τολμήσομέν τι νομοθετεῖν;

But what, in heaven’s name, said I, about business matters, the deals that men make with one another in the agora— and, if you please, contracts with workmen and actions for foul language and assault, the filing of declarations, the impanelling of juries, the payment and exaction of any dues that may be needful in markets or harbors and in general market, police or harbor regulations and the like, can we bring ourselves to legislate about these?

Ἀλλ' οὐκ ἄξιον, ἔφη, ἀνδράσι καλοῖς κἀγαθοῖς ἐπιτάττειν·

425e τὰ πολλὰ γὰρ αὐτῶν, ὅσα δεῖ νομοθετήσασθαι, ῥᾳδίως που

εὑρήσουσιν.

Nay, ʼtwould not be fitting, he said, to dictate to good and honorable men. For most of the enactments that are needed about these things they will easily, I presume, discover.

Ναί, ὦ φίλε, εἶπον, ἐάν γε θεὸς αὐτοῖς διδῷ σωτηρίαν

τῶν νόμων ὧν ἔμπροσθεν διήλθομεν.

Yes, my friend, provided God grants them the preservation of the principles of law that we have already discussed.

Εἰ δὲ μή γε, ἦ δ' ὅς, πολλὰ τοιαῦτα τιθέμενοι ἀεὶ καὶ

ἐπανορθούμενοι τὸν βίον διατελοῦσιν, οἰόμενοι ἐπιλήψεσθαι

τοῦ βελτίστου.

Failing that, said he, they will pass their lives multiplying such petty laws and amending them in the expectation of attaining what is best.

Λέγεις, ἔφην ἐγώ, βιώσεσθαι τοὺς τοιούτους ὥσπερ τοὺς

κάμνοντάς τε καὶ οὐκ ἐθέλοντας ὑπὸ ἀκολασίας ἐκβῆναι

πονηρᾶς διαίτης.

Πάνυ μὲν οὖν.

You mean, said I, that the life of such citizens will resemble that of men who are sick, yet from intemperance are unwilling to abandon their unwholesome regimen. By all means.

426a Καὶ μὴν οὗτοί γε χαριέντως διατελοῦσιν· ἰατρευόμενοι

γὰρ οὐδὲν περαίνουσιν, πλήν γε ποικιλώτερα καὶ μείζω

ποιοῦσι τὰ νοσήματα, καὶ ἀεὶ ἐλπίζοντες, ἐάν τις φάρμακον

συμβουλεύσῃ, ὑπὸ τούτου ἔσεσθαι ὑγιεῖς.

And truly, said I, these latter go on in a most charming fashion. For with all their doctoring they accomplish nothing except to complicate and augment their maladies. And they are always hoping that some one will recommend a panacea that will restore their health.

Πάνυ γάρ, ἔφη, τῶν οὕτω καμνόντων τὰ τοιαῦτα πάθη.

A perfect description, he said, of the state of such invalids.

Τί δέ; ἦν δ' ἐγώ· τόδε αὐτῶν οὐ χαρίεν, τὸ πάντων

ἔχθιστον ἡγεῖσθαι τὸν τἀληθῆ λέγοντα, ὅτι πρὶν ἂν μεθύων

καὶ ἐμπιμπλάμενος καὶ ἀφροδισιάζων καὶ ἀργῶν παύσηται,

426b οὔτε φάρμακα οὔτε καύσεις οὔτε τομαὶ οὐδ' αὖ ἐπῳδαὶ αὐτὸν

οὐδὲ περίαπτα οὐδὲ ἄλλο τῶν τοιούτων οὐδὲν ὀνήσει;

And isn’t this a charming trait in them, that they hate most in all the world him who tells them the truth that until a man stops drinking and gorging and wenching and idling, neither drugs nor cautery nor the knife, no, nor spells nor periapts will be of any avail?

Οὐ πάνυ χαρίεν, ἔφη· τὸ γὰρ τῷ εὖ λέγοντι χαλεπαίνειν

οὐκ ἔχει χάριν.

Not altogether charming, he said, for there is no grace or charm in being angry with him who speaks well.

Οὐκ ἐπαινέτης εἶ, ἔφην ἐγώ, ὡς ἔοικας, τῶν τοιούτων

ἀνδρῶν.

You do not seem to be an admirer of such people, said I.

Οὐ μέντοι μὰ Δία.

No, by heaven, I am not.

Οὐδ' ἂν ἡ πόλις ἄρα, ὅπερ ἄρτι ἐλέγομεν, ὅλη τοιοῦτον

ποιῇ, οὐκ ἐπαινέσῃ. ἢ οὐ φαίνονταί σοι ταὐτὸν ἐργάζεσθαι

τούτοις τῶν πόλεων ὅσαι κακῶς πολιτευόμεναι προαγορεύουσι

426c τοῖς πολίταις τὴν μὲν κατάστασιν τῆς πόλεως ὅλην

μὴ κινεῖν, ὡς ἀποθανουμένους, ὃς ἂν τοῦτο δρᾷ· ὃς δ' ἂν

σφᾶς οὕτω πολιτευομένους ἥδιστα θεραπεύῃ καὶ χαρίζηται

ὑποτρέχων καὶ προγιγνώσκων τὰς σφετέρας βουλήσεις καὶ

ταύτας δεινὸς ᾖ ἀποπληροῦν, οὗτος ἄρα ἀγαθός τε ἔσται

ἀνὴρ καὶ σοφὸς τὰ μεγάλα καὶ τιμήσεται ὑπὸ σφῶν;

Neither then, if an entire city, as we were just now saying, acts in this way, will it have your approval, or don’t you think that the way of such invalids is precisely that of those cities which being badly governed forewarn their citizens not to meddle with the general constitution of the state, denouncing death to whosoever attempts that—while whoever most agreeably serves them governed as they are and who curries favor with them by fawning upon them and anticipating their desires and by his cleverness in gratifying them, him they will account the good man, the man wise in worthwhile things, the man they will delight to honor?

Ταὐτὸν μὲν οὖν, ἔφη, ἔμοιγε δοκοῦσι δρᾶν, καὶ οὐδ'

ὁπωστιοῦν ἐπαινῶ.

Yes, he said, I think their conduct is identical, and I don’t approve it in the very least.

426d Τί δ' αὖ τοὺς ἐθέλοντας θεραπεύειν τὰς τοιαύτας πόλεις

καὶ προθυμουμένους; οὐκ ἄγασαι τῆς ἀνδρείας τε καὶ εὐχερείας;

And what again of those who are willing and eager to serve such states? Don’t you admire their valiance and light-hearted irresponsibility?

Ἔγωγ', ἔφη, πλήν γ' ὅσοι ἐξηπάτηνται ὑπ' αὐτῶν καὶ

οἴονται τῇ ἀληθείᾳ πολιτικοὶ εἶναι, ὅτι ἐπαινοῦνται ὑπὸ τῶν

πολλῶν.

I do, he said, except those who are actually deluded and suppose themselves to be in truth statesmen because they are praised by the many. What do you mean? Can’t you make allowances for the men?

Πῶς λέγεις; οὐ συγγιγνώσκεις, ἦν δ' ἐγώ, τοῖς ἀνδράσιν;

ἢ οἴει οἷόν τ' εἶναι ἀνδρὶ μὴ ἐπισταμένῳ μετρεῖν, ἑτέρων

426e τοιούτων πολλῶν λεγόντων ὅτι τετράπηχύς ἐστιν, αὐτὸν

ταῦτα μὴ ἡγεῖσθαι περὶ αὑτοῦ;

Do you think it possible for a man who does not know how to measure when a multitude of others equally ignorant assure him that he is four cubits tall not to suppose this to be the fact about himself?

Οὐκ αὖ, ἔφη, τοῦτό γε.

Why no, he said, I don’t think that. Then don’t be harsh with them.

Μὴ τοίνυν χαλέπαινε· καὶ γάρ πού εἰσι πάντων χαριέστατοι

οἱ τοιοῦτοι, νομοθετοῦντές τε οἷα ἄρτι διήλθομεν καὶ

ἐπανορθοῦντες, ἀεὶ οἰόμενοί τι πέρας εὑρήσειν περὶ τὰ ἐν

τοῖς συμβολαίοις κακουργήματα καὶ περὶ ἃ νυνδὴ ἐγὼ ἔλεγον,

ἀγνοοῦντες ὅτι τῷ ὄντι ὥσπερ Ὕδραν τέμνουσιν.

For surely such fellows are the most charming spectacle in the world when they enact and amend such laws as we just now described and are perpetually expecting to find a way of putting an end to frauds in business and in the other matters of which I was speaking because they can’t see that they are in very truth trying to cut off a Hydra’s head.

427a Καὶ μήν, ἔφη, οὐκ ἄλλο γέ τι ποιοῦσιν.

Indeed, he said, that is exactly what they are doing.

Ἐγὼ μὲν τοίνυν, ἦν δ' ἐγώ, τὸ τοιοῦτον εἶδος νόμων

πέρι καὶ πολιτείας οὔτ' ἐν κακῶς οὔτ' ἐν εὖ πολιτευομένῃ

πόλει ᾤμην ἂν δεῖν τὸν ἀληθινὸν νομοθέτην πραγματεύεσθαι,

ἐν τῇ μὲν ὅτι ἀνωφελῆ καὶ πλέον οὐδέν, ἐν δὲ τῇ ὅτι τὰ

μὲν αὐτῶν κἂν ὁστισοῦν εὕροι, τὰ δὲ ὅτι αὐτόματα ἔπεισιν

ἐκ τῶν ἔμπροσθεν ἐπιτηδευμάτων.

I, then, said I, should not have supposed that the true lawgiver ought to work out matters of that kind in the laws and the constitution either of an ill-governed or a well-governed state—in the one because they are useless and accomplish nothing, in the other because some of them anybody could discover and others will result spontaneously from the pursuits already described.

427b Τί οὖν, ἔφη, ἔτι ἂν ἡμῖν λοιπὸν τῆς νομοθεσίας εἴη;

What part of legislation, then, he said, is still left for us?

Καὶ ἐγὼ εἶπον ὅτι Ἡμῖν μὲν οὐδέν, τῷ μέντοι Ἀπόλλωνι

τῷ ἐν Δελφοῖς τά γε μέγιστα καὶ κάλλιστα καὶ πρῶτα

τῶν νομοθετημάτων.

And I replied, For us nothing, but for the Apollo of Delphi, the chief, the fairest and the first of enactments.

Τὰ ποῖα; ἦ δ' ὅς.

What are they? he said.

Ἱερῶν τε ἱδρύσεις καὶ θυσίαι καὶ ἄλλαι θεῶν τε καὶ

δαιμόνων καὶ ἡρώων θεραπεῖαι· τελευτησάντων <τε> αὖ θῆκαι

καὶ ὅσα τοῖς ἐκεῖ δεῖ ὑπηρετοῦντας ἵλεως αὐτοὺς ἔχειν. τὰ

γὰρ δὴ τοιαῦτα οὔτ' ἐπιστάμεθα ἡμεῖς οἰκίζοντές τε πόλιν

427c οὐδενὶ ἄλλῳ πεισόμεθα, ἐὰν νοῦν ἔχωμεν, οὐδὲ χρησόμεθα

ἐξηγητῇ ἀλλ' ἢ τῷ πατρίῳ· οὗτος γὰρ δήπου ὁ θεὸς περὶ τὰ

τοιαῦτα πᾶσιν ἀνθρώποις πάτριος ἐξηγητὴς [ἐν μέσῳ] τῆς

γῆς ἐπὶ τοῦ ὀμφαλοῦ καθήμενος ἐξηγεῖται.

The founding of temples, and sacrifices, and other forms of worship of gods, daemons, and heroes; and likewise the burial of the dead and the services we must render to the dwellers in the world beyond to keep them gracious. For of such matters we neither know anything nor in the founding of our city if we are wise shall we entrust them to any other or make use of any other interpreter than the God of our fathers. For this God surely is in such matters for all mankind the interpreter of the religion of their fathers who from his seat in the middle and at the very navel of the earth delivers his interpretation.

Καὶ καλῶς γ', ἔφη, λέγεις· καὶ ποιητέον οὕτω.

Ὠικισμένη μὲν τοίνυν, ἦν δ' ἐγώ, ἤδη ἄν σοι εἴη, ὦ παῖ

427d Ἀρίστωνος, ἡ πόλις· τὸ δὲ δὴ μετὰ τοῦτο σκόπει ἐν αὐτῇ,

φῶς ποθὲν πορισάμενος ἱκανόν, αὐτός τε καὶ τὸν ἀδελφὸν

παρακάλει καὶ Πολέμαρχον καὶ τοὺς ἄλλους, ἐάν πως ἴδωμεν

ποῦ ποτ' ἂν εἴη ἡ δικαιοσύνη καὶ ποῦ ἡ ἀδικία, καὶ τί ἀλλήλοιν

διαφέρετον, καὶ πότερον δεῖ κεκτῆσθαι τὸν μέλλοντα

εὐδαίμονα εἶναι, ἐάντε λανθάνῃ ἐάντε μὴ πάντας θεούς τε

καὶ ἀνθρώπους.

Excellently said, he replied; and that is what we must do. At last, then, son of Ariston, said I, your city may be considered as established. The next thing is to procure a sufficient light somewhere and to look yourself, and call in the aid of your brother and of Polemarchus and the rest, if we may in any wise discover where justice and injustice should be in it, wherein they differ from one another and which of the two he must have who is to be happy, alike whether his condition is known or not known to all gods and men.

Οὐδὲν λέγεις, ἔφη ὁ Γλαύκων· σὺ γὰρ ὑπέσχου ζητήσειν,

427e ὡς οὐχ ὅσιόν σοι ὂν μὴ οὐ βοηθεῖν δικαιοσύνῃ εἰς δύναμιν

παντὶ τρόπῳ.

Nonsense, said Glaucon, you promised that you would carry on the search yourself, admitting that it would be impious for you not to come to the aid of justice by every means in your power.

Ἀληθῆ, ἔφην ἐγώ, ὑπομιμνῄσκεις, καὶ ποιητέον μέν γε

οὕτως, χρὴ δὲ καὶ ὑμᾶς συλλαμβάνειν.

A true reminder, I said, and I must do so, but you also must lend a hand.

Ἀλλ', ἔφη, ποιήσομεν οὕτω.

Well, he said, we will.

Ἐλπίζω τοίνυν, ἦν δ' ἐγώ, εὑρήσειν αὐτὸ ὧδε. οἶμαι

ἡμῖν τὴν πόλιν, εἴπερ ὀρθῶς γε ᾤκισται, τελέως ἀγαθὴν

εἶναι.

I expect then, said I, that we shall find it in this way. I think our city, if it has been rightly founded is good in the full sense of the word.

Ἀνάγκη γ', ἔφη.

Necessarily, he said.

Δῆλον δὴ ὅτι σοφή τ' ἐστὶ καὶ ἀνδρεία καὶ σώφρων καὶ

δικαία.

Clearly, then, it will be wise, brave, sober, and just.

Δῆλον.

Clearly.

Οὐκοῦν ὅτι ἂν αὐτῶν εὕρωμεν ἐν αὐτῇ, τὸ ὑπόλοιπον

ἔσται τὸ οὐχ ηὑρημένον;

Then if we find any of these qualities in it, the remainder will be that which we have not found?

428a Τί μήν;

Surely. Take the case of any four other things.

Ὥσπερ τοίνυν ἄλλων τινῶν τεττάρων, εἰ ἕν τι ἐζητοῦμεν

αὐτῶν ἐν ὁτῳοῦν, ὁπότε πρῶτον ἐκεῖνο ἔγνωμεν, ἱκανῶς ἂν

εἶχεν ἡμῖν, εἰ δὲ τὰ τρία πρότερον ἐγνωρίσαμεν, αὐτῷ ἂν

τούτῳ ἐγνώριστο τὸ ζητούμενον· δῆλον γὰρ ὅτι οὐκ ἄλλο

ἔτι ἦν ἢ τὸ ὑπολειφθέν.

If we were looking for any one of them in anything and recognized the object of our search first, that would have been enough for us, but if we had recognized the other three first, that in itself would have made known to us the thing we were seeking. For plainly there was nothing left for it to be but the remainder.

Ὀρθῶς, ἔφη, λέγεις.

Right, he said.

Οὐκοῦν καὶ περὶ τούτων, ἐπειδὴ τέτταρα ὄντα τυγχάνει,

ὡσαύτως ζητητέον;

And so, since these are four, we must conduct the search in the same way.

Δῆλα δή.

Clearly.

Καὶ μὲν δὴ πρῶτόν γέ μοι δοκεῖ ἐν αὐτῷ κατάδηλον εἶναι

428b ἡ σοφία· καί τι ἄτοπον περὶ αὐτὴν φαίνεται.

And, moreover, the first thing that I think I clearly see therein is the wisdom, and there is something odd about that, it appears.

Τί; ἦ δ' ὅς.

What? said he.

Σοφὴ μὲν τῷ ὄντι δοκεῖ μοι ἡ πόλις εἶναι ἣν διήλθομεν·

εὔβουλος γάρ, οὐχί;

Wise in very deed I think the city that we have described is, for it is well counselled, is it not?

Ναί.

Yes.

Καὶ μὴν τοῦτό γε αὐτό, ἡ εὐβουλία, δῆλον ὅτι ἐπιστήμη

τίς ἐστιν· οὐ γάρ που ἀμαθίᾳ γε ἀλλ' ἐπιστήμῃ εὖ βουλεύονται.

And surely this very thing, good counsel, is a form of wisdom. For it is not by ignorance but by knowledge that men counsel well.

Δῆλον.

Obviously.

Πολλαὶ δέ γε καὶ παντοδαπαὶ ἐπιστῆμαι ἐν τῇ πόλει εἰσίν.

But there are many and manifold knowledges or sciences in the city.

Πῶς γὰρ οὔ;

Of course.

Ἆρ' οὖν διὰ τὴν τῶν τεκτόνων ἐπιστήμην σοφὴ καὶ

εὔβουλος ἡ πόλις προσρητέα;

Is it then owing to the science of her carpenters that a city is to be called wise and well advised?

428c Οὐδαμῶς, ἔφη, διά γε ταύτην, ἀλλὰ τεκτονική.

By no means for that, but rather mistress of the arts of building.

Οὐκ ἄρα διὰ τὴν ὑπὲρ τῶν ξυλίνων σκευῶν ἐπιστήμην,

βουλευομένη ὡς ἂν ἔχοι βέλτιστα, σοφὴ κλητέα πόλις.

Then a city is not to be styled wise because of the deliberations of the science of wooden utensils for their best production?

Οὐ μέντοι.

No, I grant you.

Τί δέ; τὴν ὑπὲρ τῶν ἐκ τοῦ χαλκοῦ ἤ τινα ἄλλην τῶν

τοιούτων;

Is it, then, because of that of brass implements or any other of that kind?

Οὐδ' ἡντινοῦν, ἔφη.

None whatsoever, he said.

Οὐδὲ τὴν ὑπὲρ τοῦ καρποῦ τῆς γενέσεως ἐκ τῆς γῆς,

ἀλλὰ γεωργική.

Nor yet because of the science of the production of crops from the soil, but the name it takes from that is agricultural.

Δοκεῖ μοι.

I think so.

Τί δ'; ἦν δ' ἐγώ· ἔστι τις ἐπιστήμη ἐν τῇ ἄρτι ὑφ'

ἡμῶν οἰκισθείσῃ παρά τισι τῶν πολιτῶν, ᾗ οὐχ ὑπὲρ τῶν

428d ἐν τῇ πόλει τινὸς βουλεύεται, ἀλλ' ὑπὲρ αὑτῆς ὅλης, ὅντινα

τρόπον αὐτή τε πρὸς αὑτὴν καὶ πρὸς τὰς ἄλλας πόλεις

ἄριστα ὁμιλοῖ;

Then, said I, is there any science in the city just founded by us residing in any of its citizens which does not take counsel about some particular thing in the city but about the city as a whole and the betterment of its relations with itself and other states?

Ἔστι μέντοι.

Why, there is.

Τίς, ἔφην ἐγώ, καὶ ἐν τίσιν;

What is it, said I, and in whom is it found?

Αὕτη, ἦ δ' ὅς, ἡ φυλακική, καὶ ἐν τούτοις τοῖς ἄρχουσιν

οὓς νυνδὴ τελέους φύλακας ὠνομάζομεν.

It is the science of guardianship or government and it is to be found in those rulers to whom we just now gave the name of guardians in the full sense of the word.

Διὰ ταύτην οὖν τὴν ἐπιστήμην τί τὴν πόλιν προσαγορεύεις;

And what term then do you apply to the city because of this knowledge?

Εὔβουλον, ἔφη, καὶ τῷ ὄντι σοφήν.

Well advised, he said, and truly wise.

Πότερον οὖν, ἦν δ' ἐγώ, ἐν τῇ πόλει οἴει ἡμῖν χαλκέας

428e πλείους ἐνέσεσθαι ἢ τοὺς ἀληθινοὺς φύλακας τούτους;

Which class, then, said I, do you suppose will be the more numerous in our city, the smiths or these true guardians?

Πολύ, ἔφη, χαλκέας.

The smiths, by far, he said.

Οὐκοῦν, ἔφην, καὶ τῶν ἄλλων ὅσοι ἐπιστήμας ἔχοντες

ὀνομάζονταί τινες εἶναι, πάντων τούτων οὗτοι ἂν εἶεν

ὀλίγιστοι;

And would not these rulers be the smallest of all the groups of those who possess special knowledge and receive distinctive appellations?

Πολύ γε.

By far.

Τῷ σμικροτάτῳ ἄρα ἔθνει καὶ μέρει ἑαυτῆς καὶ τῇ ἐν

τούτῳ ἐπιστήμῃ, τῷ προεστῶτι καὶ ἄρχοντι, ὅλη σοφὴ ἂν

εἴη κατὰ φύσιν οἰκισθεῖσα πόλις· καὶ τοῦτο, ὡς ἔοικε, φύσει

429a ὀλίγιστον γίγνεται γένος, ᾧ προσήκει ταύτης τῆς ἐπιστήμης

μεταλαγχάνειν ἣν μόνην δεῖ τῶν ἄλλων ἐπιστημῶν σοφίαν

καλεῖσθαι.

Then it is by virtue of its smallest class and minutest part of itself, and the wisdom that resides therein, in the part which takes the lead and rules, that a city established on principles of nature would be wise as a whole. And as it appears these are by nature the fewest, the class to which it pertains to partake of the knowledge which alone of all forms of knowledge deserves the name of wisdom.

Ἀληθέστατα, ἔφη, λέγεις.

Most true, he said.

Τοῦτο μὲν δὴ ἓν τῶν τεττάρων οὐκ οἶδα ὅντινα τρόπον

ηὑρήκαμεν, αὐτό τε καὶ ὅπου τῆς πόλεως ἵδρυται.

This one of our four, then, we have, I know not how, discovered, the thing itself and its place in the state.

Ἐμοὶ γοῦν δοκεῖ, ἔφη, ἀποχρώντως ηὑρῆσθαι.

I certainly think, said he, that it has been discovered sufficiently.

Ἀλλὰ μὴν ἀνδρεία γε αὐτή τε καὶ ἐν ᾧ κεῖται τῆς

πόλεως, δι' ὃ τοιαύτη κλητέα ἡ πόλις, οὐ πάνυ χαλεπὸν

ἰδεῖν.

But again there is no difficulty in seeing bravery itself and the part of the city in which it resides for which the city is called brave.

Πῶς δή;

How so?

429b Τίς ἄν, ἦν δ' ἐγώ, εἰς ἄλλο τι ἀποβλέψας ἢ δειλὴν ἢ

ἀνδρείαν πόλιν εἴποι ἀλλ' ἢ εἰς τοῦτο τὸ μέρος ὃ προπολεμεῖ

τε καὶ στρατεύεται ὑπὲρ αὐτῆς;

Who, said I, in calling a city cowardly or brave would fix his eyes on any other part of it than that which defends it and wages war in its behalf?

Οὐδ' ἂν εἷς, ἔφη, εἰς ἄλλο τι.

No one at all, he said.

Οὐ γὰρ οἶμαι, εἶπον, οἵ γε ἄλλοι ἐν αὐτῇ ἢ δειλοὶ ἢ

ἀνδρεῖοι ὄντες κύριοι ἂν εἶεν ἢ τοίαν αὐτὴν εἶναι ἢ τοίαν.

For the reason, I take it, said I, that the cowardice or the bravery of the other inhabitants does not determine for it the one quality or the other.

Οὐ γάρ.

It does not.

Καὶ ἀνδρεία ἄρα πόλις μέρει τινὶ ἑαυτῆς ἐστι, διὰ τὸ ἐν

ἐκείνῳ ἔχειν δύναμιν τοιαύτην ἣ διὰ παντὸς σώσει τὴν περὶ

429c τῶν δεινῶν δόξαν, ταῦτά τε αὐτὰ εἶναι καὶ τοιαῦτα, ἅ τε καὶ

οἷα ὁ νομοθέτης παρήγγελλεν ἐν τῇ παιδείᾳ. ἢ οὐ τοῦτο

ἀνδρείαν καλεῖς;

Bravery too, then, belongs to a city by virtue of a part of itself owing to its possession in that part of a quality that under all conditions will preserve the conviction that things to be feared are precisely those which and such as the lawgiver inculcated in their education. Is not that what you call bravery?

Οὐ πάνυ, ἔφη, ἔμαθον ὃ εἶπες, ἀλλ' αὖθις εἰπέ.

I don’t altogether understand what you said, he replied; but say it again.

Σωτηρίαν ἔγωγ', εἶπον, λέγω τινὰ εἶναι τὴν ἀνδρείαν.

A kind of conservation, I said, is what I mean by bravery.

Ποίαν δὴ σωτηρίαν;

What sort of a conservation?

Τὴν τῆς δόξης τῆς ὑπὸ νόμου διὰ τῆς παιδείας γεγονυίας

περὶ τῶν δεινῶν ἅ τέ ἐστι καὶ οἷα· διὰ παντὸς δὲ ἔλεγον αὐτῆς

σωτηρίαν τὸ ἔν τε λύπαις ὄντα διασῴζεσθαι αὐτὴν καὶ ἐν

429d ἡδοναῖς καὶ ἐν ἐπιθυμίαις καὶ ἐν φόβοις καὶ μὴ ἐκβάλλειν.

ᾧ δέ μοι δοκεῖ ὅμοιον εἶναι ἐθέλω ἀπεικάσαι, εἰ βούλει.

The conservation of the conviction which the law has created by education about fearful things—what and what sort of things are to be feared. And by the phrase under all conditions I mean that the brave man preserves it both in pain and pleasures and in desires and fears and does not expel it from his soul. And I may illustrate it by a similitude if you please.

Ἀλλὰ βούλομαι.

I do.

Οὐκοῦν οἶσθα, ἦν δ' ἐγώ, ὅτι οἱ βαφῆς, ἐπειδὰν βουληθῶσι

βάψαι ἔρια ὥστ' εἶναι ἁλουργά, πρῶτον μὲν ἐκλέγονται

ἐκ τοσούτων χρωμάτων μίαν φύσιν τὴν τῶν λευκῶν, ἔπειτα

προπαρασκευάζουσιν, οὐκ ὀλίγῃ παρασκευῇ θεραπεύσαντες

ὅπως δέξεται ὅτι μάλιστα τὸ ἄνθος, καὶ οὕτω δὴ βάπτουσι.

429e καὶ ὃ μὲν ἂν τούτῳ τῷ τρόπῳ βαφῇ, δευσοποιὸν γίγνεται τὸ

βαφέν, καὶ ἡ πλύσις οὔτ' ἄνευ ῥυμμάτων οὔτε μετὰ ῥυμμάτων

δύναται αὐτῶν τὸ ἄνθος ἀφαιρεῖσθαι· ἃ δ' ἂν μή,

οἶσθα οἷα δὴ γίγνεται, ἐάντέ τις ἄλλα χρώματα βάπτῃ ἐάντε

καὶ ταῦτα μὴ προθεραπεύσας.

You are aware that dyers when they wish to dye wool so as to hold the purple hue begin by selecting from the many colors there be the one nature of the white and then give it a careful preparatory treatment so that it will take the hue in the best way, and after the treatment, then and then only, dip it in the dye. And things that are dyed by this process become fast-colored and washing either with or without lyes cannot take away the sheen of their hues. But otherwise you know what happens to them, whether anyone dips other colors or even these without the preparatory treatment.

Οἶδα, ἔφη, ὅτι καὶ ἔκπλυτα καὶ γελοῖα.

I know, he said, that they present a ridiculous and washed-out appearance.

Τοιοῦτον τοίνυν, ἦν δ' ἐγώ, ὑπόλαβε κατὰ δύναμιν ἐργάζεσθαι

καὶ ἡμᾶς, ὅτε ἐξελεγόμεθα τοὺς στρατιώτας καὶ

430a ἐπαιδεύομεν μουσικῇ καὶ γυμναστικῇ· μηδὲν οἴου ἄλλο μηχανᾶσθαι

ἢ ὅπως ἡμῖν ὅτι κάλλιστα τοὺς νόμους πεισθέντες

δέξοιντο ὥσπερ βαφήν, ἵνα δευσοποιὸς αὐτῶν ἡ δόξα γίγνοιτο

καὶ περὶ δεινῶν καὶ περὶ τῶν ἄλλων διὰ τὸ τήν τε φύσιν

καὶ τὴν τροφὴν ἐπιτηδείαν ἐσχηκέναι, καὶ μὴ αὐτῶν ἐκπλύναι

τὴν βαφὴν τὰ ῥύμματα ταῦτα, δεινὰ ὄντα ἐκκλύζειν, ἥ

τε ἡδονή, παντὸς χαλεστραίου δεινοτέρα οὖσα τοῦτο δρᾶν

430b καὶ κονίας, λύπη τε καὶ φόβος καὶ ἐπιθυμία, παντὸς ἄλλου

ῥύμματος. τὴν δὴ τοιαύτην δύναμιν καὶ σωτηρίαν διὰ

παντὸς δόξης ὀρθῆς τε καὶ νομίμου δεινῶν τε πέρι καὶ μὴ

ἀνδρείαν ἔγωγε καλῶ καὶ τίθεμαι, εἰ μή τι σὺ ἄλλο

λέγεις.

By this analogy, then, said I, you must conceive what we too to the best of our ability were doing when we selected our soldiers and educated them in music and exercises of the body. The sole aim of our contrivance was that they should be convinced and receive our laws like a dye as it were, so that their belief and faith might be fast-colored both about the things that are to be feared and all other things because of the fitness of their nature and nurture, and that so their dyes might not be washed out by those lyes that have such dread power to scour our faiths away, pleasure more potent than any detergent or abstergent to accomplish this, and pain and fear and desire more sure than any lye. This power in the soul, then, this unfailing conservation of right and lawful belief about things to be and not to be feared is what I call and would assume to be courage, unless you have something different to say.

Ἀλλ' οὐδέν, ἦ δ' ὅς, λέγω· δοκεῖς γάρ μοι τὴν ὀρθὴν

δόξαν περὶ τῶν αὐτῶν τούτων ἄνευ παιδείας γεγονυῖαν, τήν

τε θηριώδη καὶ ἀνδραποδώδη, οὔτε πάνυ νόμιμον ἡγεῖσθαι,

ἄλλο τέ τι ἢ ἀνδρείαν καλεῖν.

No, nothing, said he; for I presume that you consider mere right opinion about the same matters not produced by education, that which may manifest itself in a beast or a slave, to have little or nothing to do with law and that you would call it by another name than courage.

430c Ἀληθέστατα, ἦν δ' ἐγώ, λέγεις.

That is most true, said I.

Ἀποδέχομαι τοίνυν τοῦτο ἀνδρείαν εἶναι.

Well then, he said, I accept this as bravery.

Καὶ γὰρ ἀποδέχου, ἦν δ' ἐγώ, πολιτικήν γε, καὶ ὀρθῶς

ἀποδέξῃ· αὖθις δὲ περὶ αὐτοῦ, ἐὰν βούλῃ, ἔτι κάλλιον

δίιμεν. νῦν γὰρ οὐ τοῦτο ἐζητοῦμεν, ἀλλὰ δικαιοσύνην·

πρὸς οὖν τὴν ἐκείνου ζήτησιν, ὡς ἐγᾦμαι, ἱκανῶς ἔχει.

Do so, said I, and you will be right with the reservation that it is the courage of a citizen. Some other time, if it please you, we will discuss it more fully. At present we were not seeking this but justice; and for the purpose of that inquiry I believe we have done enough.

Ἀλλὰ καλῶς, ἔφη, λέγεις.

Δύο μήν, ἦν δ' ἐγώ, ἔτι λοιπὰ ἃ δεῖ κατιδεῖν ἐν τῇ

430d πόλει, ἥ τε σωφροσύνη καὶ οὗ δὴ ἕνεκα πάντα ζητοῦμεν,

δικαιοσύνη.

You are quite right, he said. Two things still remain, said I, to make out in our city, soberness and the object of the whole inquiry, justice.

Πάνυ μὲν οὖν.

Quite so.

Πῶς οὖν ἂν τὴν δικαιοσύνην εὕροιμεν, ἵνα μηκέτι πραγματευώμεθα

περὶ σωφροσύνης;

If there were only some way to discover justice so that we need not further concern ourselves about soberness.

Ἐγὼ μὲν τοίνυν, ἔφη, οὔτε οἶδα οὔτ' ἂν βουλοίμην αὐτὸ

πρότερον φανῆναι, εἴπερ μηκέτι ἐπισκεψόμεθα σωφροσύνην·

ἀλλ' εἰ ἔμοιγε βούλει χαρίζεσθαι, σκόπει πρότερον τοῦτο

ἐκείνου.

Well, I, for my part, he said, neither know of any such way nor would I wish justice to be discovered first if that means that we are not to go on to the consideration of soberness. But if you desire to please me, consider this before that. It would certainly

430e Ἀλλὰ μέντοι, ἦν δ' ἐγώ, βούλομαί γε, εἰ μὴ ἀδικῶ.

be very wrong of me not to desire it, said I.

Σκόπει δή, ἔφη.

Go on with the inquiry then, he said.

Σκεπτέον, εἶπον· καὶ ὥς γε ἐντεῦθεν ἰδεῖν, συμφωνίᾳ τινὶ

καὶ ἁρμονίᾳ προσέοικεν μᾶλλον ἢ τὰ πρότερον.

I must go on, I replied, and viewed from here it bears more likeness to a kind of concord and harmony than the other virtues did.

Πῶς;

How so?

Κόσμος πού τις, ἦν δ' ἐγώ, ἡ σωφροσύνη ἐστὶν καὶ ἡδονῶν

τινων καὶ ἐπιθυμιῶν ἐγκράτεια, ὥς φασι κρείττω δὴ αὑτοῦ

ἀποφαίνοντες οὐκ οἶδ' ὅντινα τρόπον, καὶ ἄλλα ἄττα τοιαῦτα

ὥσπερ ἴχνη αὐτῆς λέγεται. ἦ γάρ;

Soberness is a kind of beautiful order and a continence of certain pleasures and appetites, as they say, using the phrase master of himself I know not how; and there are other similar expressions that as it were point us to the same trail. Is that not so?

Πάντων μάλιστα, ἔφη.

Most certainly.

Οὐκοῦν τὸ μὲν κρείττω αὑτοῦ γελοῖον; ὁ γὰρ ἑαυτοῦ

κρείττων καὶ ἥττων δήπου ἂν αὑτοῦ εἴη καὶ ὁ ἥττων κρείττων·

431a ὁ αὐτὸς γὰρ ἐν ἅπασιν τούτοις προσαγορεύεται.

Now the phrase master of himself is an absurdity, is it not? For he who is master of himself would also be subject to himself, and he who is subject to himself would be master. For the same person is spoken of in all these expressions.

Τί δ' οὔ;

Of course.

Ἀλλ', ἦν δ' ἐγώ, φαίνεταί μοι βούλεσθαι λέγειν οὗτος ὁ

λόγος ὥς τι ἐν αὐτῷ τῷ ἀνθρώπῳ περὶ τὴν ψυχὴν τὸ μὲν

βέλτιον ἔνι, τὸ δὲ χεῖρον, καὶ ὅταν μὲν τὸ βέλτιον φύσει

τοῦ χείρονος ἐγκρατὲς ᾖ, τοῦτο λέγειν τὸ κρείττω αὑτοῦ

—ἐπαινεῖ γοῦν—ὅταν δὲ ὑπὸ τροφῆς κακῆς ἤ τινος ὁμιλίας

κρατηθῇ ὑπὸ πλήθους τοῦ χείρονος σμικρότερον τὸ βέλτιον

431b ὄν, τοῦτο δὲ ὡς ἐν ὀνείδει ψέγειν τε καὶ καλεῖν ἥττω ἑαυτοῦ

καὶ ἀκόλαστον τὸν οὕτω διακείμενον.

But, said I, the intended meaning of this way of speaking appears to me to be that the soul of a man within him has a better part and a worse part, and the expression self-mastery means the control of the worse by the naturally better part. It is, at any rate, a term of praise. But when, because of bad breeding or some association, the better part, which is the smaller, is dominated by the multitude of the worse, I think that our speech censures this as a reproach, and calls the man in this plight unselfcontrolled and licentious.

Καὶ γὰρ ἔοικεν, ἔφη.

That seems likely, he said.

Ἀπόβλεπε τοίνυν, ἦν δ' ἐγώ, πρὸς τὴν νέαν ἡμῖν πόλιν,

καὶ εὑρήσεις ἐν αὐτῇ τὸ ἕτερον τούτων ἐνόν· κρείττω γὰρ αὐτὴν

αὑτῆς δικαίως φήσεις προσαγορεύεσθαι, εἴπερ οὗ τὸ ἄμεινον

τοῦ χείρονος ἄρχει σῶφρον κλητέον καὶ κρεῖττον αὑτοῦ.

Turn your eyes now upon our new city, said I, and you will find one of these conditions existent in it. For you will say that it is justly spoken of as master of itself if that in which the superior rules the inferior is to be called sober and self-mastered.

Ἀλλ' ἀποβλέπω, ἔφη, καὶ ἀληθῆ λέγεις.

I do turn my eyes upon it, he said, and it is as you say.

Καὶ μὴν καὶ τάς γε πολλὰς καὶ παντοδαπὰς ἐπιθυμίας καὶ

431c ἡδονάς τε καὶ λύπας ἐν παισὶ μάλιστα ἄν τις εὕροι καὶ

γυναιξὶ καὶ οἰκέταις καὶ τῶν ἐλευθέρων λεγομένων ἐν τοῖς

πολλοῖς τε καὶ φαύλοις.

And again, the mob of motley appetites and pleasures and pains one would find chiefly in children and women and slaves and in the base rabble of those who are freemen in name.

Πάνυ μὲν οὖν.

By all means.

Τὰς δέ γε ἁπλᾶς τε καὶ μετρίας, αἳ δὴ μετὰ νοῦ τε καὶ

δόξης ὀρθῆς λογισμῷ ἄγονται, ἐν ὀλίγοις τε ἐπιτεύξῃ καὶ

τοῖς βέλτιστα μὲν φῦσιν, βέλτιστα δὲ παιδευθεῖσιν.

But the simple and moderate appetites which with the aid of reason and right opinion are guided by consideration you will find in few and those the best born and best educated.

Ἀληθῆ, ἔφη.

True, he said.

Οὐκοῦν καὶ ταῦτα ὁρᾷς ἐνόντα σοι ἐν τῇ πόλει καὶ

κρατουμένας αὐτόθι τὰς ἐπιθυμίας τὰς ἐν τοῖς πολλοῖς τε

431d καὶ φαύλοις ὑπό τε τῶν ἐπιθυμιῶν καὶ τῆς φρονήσεως τῆς

ἐν τοῖς ἐλάττοσί τε καὶ ἐπιεικεστέροις;

And do you not find this too in your city and a domination there of the desires in the multitude and the rabble by the desires and the wisdom that dwell in the minority of the better?

Ἔγωγ', ἔφη.

I do, he said.

Εἰ ἄρα δεῖ τινα πόλιν προσαγορεύειν κρείττω ἡδονῶν τε

καὶ ἐπιθυμιῶν καὶ αὐτὴν αὑτῆς, καὶ ταύτην προσρητέον.

If, then, there is any city that deserves to be described as master of its pleasures and desires and self-mastered, this one merits that designation.

Παντάπασιν μὲν οὖν, ἔφη.

Most assuredly, he said.

Ἆρ' οὖν οὐ καὶ σώφρονα κατὰ πάντα ταῦτα;

And is it not also to be called sober in all these respects?

Καὶ μάλα, ἔφη.

Indeed it is, he said.

Καὶ μὴν εἴπερ αὖ ἐν ἄλλῃ πόλει ἡ αὐτὴ δόξα ἔνεστι τοῖς

431e τε ἄρχουσι καὶ ἀρχομένοις περὶ τοῦ οὕστινας δεῖ ἄρχειν, καὶ

ἐν ταύτῃ ἂν εἴη τοῦτο ἐνόν. ἢ οὐ δοκεῖ;

And yet again, if there is any city in which the rulers and the ruled are of one mind as to who ought to rule, that condition will be found in this. Don’t you think so?

Καὶ μάλα, ἔφη, σφόδρα.

I most emphatically do, he said.

Ἐν ποτέροις οὖν φήσεις τῶν πολιτῶν τὸ σωφρονεῖν ἐνεῖναι

ὅταν οὕτως ἔχωσιν; ἐν τοῖς ἄρχουσιν ἢ ἐν τοῖς ἀρχομένοις;

In which class of the citizens, then, will you say that the virtue of soberness has its seat when this is their condition? In the rulers or in the ruled?

Ἐν ἀμφοτέροις που, ἔφη.

In both, I suppose, he said.

Ὁρᾷς οὖν, ἦν δ' ἐγώ, ὅτι ἐπιεικῶς ἐμαντευόμεθα ἄρτι ὡς

ἁρμονίᾳ τινὶ ἡ σωφροσύνη ὡμοίωται;

Do you see then, said I, that our intuition was not a bad one just now that discerned a likeness between soberness and a kind of harmony?

Τί δή;

Why so?

Ὅτι οὐχ ὥσπερ ἡ ἀνδρεία καὶ ἡ σοφία ἐν μέρει τινὶ

432a ἑκατέρα ἐνοῦσα ἡ μὲν σοφήν, ἡ δὲ ἀνδρείαν τὴν πόλιν

παρείχετο, οὐχ οὕτω ποιεῖ αὕτη, ἀλλὰ δι' ὅλης ἀτεχνῶς

τέταται διὰ πασῶν παρεχομένη συνᾴδοντας τούς τε ἀσθενεστάτους

ταὐτὸν καὶ τοὺς ἰσχυροτάτους καὶ τοὺς μέσους, εἰ

μὲν βούλει, φρονήσει, εἰ δὲ βούλει, ἰσχύι, εἰ δέ, καὶ πλήθει

ἢ χρήμασιν ἢ ἄλλῳ ὁτῳοῦν τῶν τοιούτων· ὥστε ὀρθότατ' ἂν

φαῖμεν ταύτην τὴν ὁμόνοιαν σωφροσύνην εἶναι, χείρονός τε

καὶ ἀμείνονος κατὰ φύσιν συμφωνίαν ὁπότερον δεῖ ἄρχειν

καὶ ἐν πόλει καὶ ἐν ἑνὶ ἑκάστῳ.

Because its operation is unlike that of courage and wisdom, which residing in separate parts respectively made the city, the one wise and the other brave. That is not the way of soberness, but it extends literally through the entire gamut throughout, bringing about the unison in the same chant of the strongest, the weakest and the intermediate, whether in wisdom or, if you please, in strength, or for that matter in numbers, wealth, or any similar criterion. So that we should be quite right in affirming this unanimity to be soberness, the concord of the naturally superior and inferior as to which ought to rule both in the state and the individual.

432b Πάνυ μοι, ἔφη, συνδοκεῖ.

I entirely concur, he said.

Εἶεν, ἦν δ' ἐγώ· τὰ μὲν τρία ἡμῖν ἐν τῇ πόλει κατῶπται,

ὥς γε οὑτωσὶ δόξαι· τὸ δὲ δὴ λοιπὸν εἶδος, δι' ὃ ἂν ἔτι

ἀρετῆς μετέχοι πόλις, τί ποτ' ἂν εἴη; δῆλον γὰρ ὅτι τοῦτ'

ἐστὶν ἡ δικαιοσύνη.

Very well, said I. We have made out these three forms in our city to the best of our present judgement. What can be the remaining form that would give the city still another virtue? For it is obvious that the remainder is justice.

Δῆλον.

Obvious.

Οὐκοῦν, ὦ Γλαύκων, νῦν δὴ ἡμᾶς δεῖ ὥσπερ κυνηγέτας

τινὰς θάμνον κύκλῳ περιίστασθαι προσέχοντας τὸν νοῦν, μή

πῃ διαφύγῃ ἡ δικαιοσύνη καὶ ἀφανισθεῖσα ἄδηλος γένηται.

432c φανερὸν γὰρ δὴ ὅτι ταύτῃ πῃ ἔστιν· ὅρα οὖν καὶ προθυμοῦ

κατιδεῖν, ἐάν πως πρότερος ἐμοῦ ἴδῃς καὶ ἐμοὶ φράσῃς.

Now then, Glaucon, is the time for us like huntsmen to surround the covert and keep close watch that justice may not slip through and get away from us and vanish from our sight. It plainly must be somewhere hereabouts. Keep your eyes open then and do your best to descry it. You may see it before I do and point it out to me.

Εἰ γὰρ ὤφελον, ἔφη. ἀλλὰ μᾶλλον, ἐάν μοι ἑπομένῳ χρῇ

καὶ τὰ δεικνύμενα δυναμένῳ καθορᾶν, πάνυ μοι μετρίως χρήσῃ.

Would that I could, he said; but I think rather that if you find in me one who can follow you and discern what you point out to him you will be making a very fair use of me.

Ἕπου, ἦν δ' ἐγώ, εὐξάμενος μετ' ἐμοῦ.

Pray for success then, said I, and follow along with me.

Ποιήσω ταῦτα, ἀλλὰ μόνον, ἦ δ' ὅς, ἡγοῦ.

That I will do, only lead on, he said.

Καὶ μήν, εἶπον ἐγώ, δύσβατός γέ τις ὁ τόπος φαίνεται

καὶ ἐπίσκιος· ἔστι γοῦν σκοτεινὸς καὶ δυσδιερεύνητος. ἀλλὰ

γὰρ ὅμως ἰτέον.

And truly, said I, it appears to be an inaccessible place, lying in deep shadows. It certainly is a dark covert, not easy to beat up.

432d Ἰτέον γάρ, ἔφη.

But all the same on we must go. Yes, on.

Καὶ ἐγὼ κατιδών, Ἰοὺ ἰού, εἶπον, ὦ Γλαύκων· κινδυνεύομέν

τι ἔχειν ἴχνος, καί μοι δοκεῖ οὐ πάνυ τι ἐκφευξεῖσθαι ἡμᾶς.

And I caught view and gave a hulloa and said, Glaucon, I think we have found its trail and I don’t believe it will get away from us.

Εὖ ἀγγέλλεις, ἦ δ' ὅς.

I am glad to hear that, said he.

Ἦ μήν, ἦν δ' ἐγώ, βλακικόν γε ἡμῶν τὸ πάθος.

Truly, said I, we were slackers indeed.

Τὸ ποῖον;

How so?

Πάλαι, ὦ μακάριε, φαίνεται πρὸ ποδῶν ἡμῖν ἐξ ἀρχῆς

κυλινδεῖσθαι, καὶ οὐχ ἑωρῶμεν ἄρ' αὐτό, ἀλλ' ἦμεν καταγελαστότατοι·

ὥσπερ οἱ ἐν ταῖς χερσὶν ἔχοντες ζητοῦσιν

432e ἐνίοτε ὃ ἔχουσιν, καὶ ἡμεῖς εἰς αὐτὸ μὲν οὐκ ἀπεβλέπομεν,

πόρρω δέ ποι ἀπεσκοποῦμεν, ᾗ δὴ καὶ ἐλάνθανεν ἴσως

ἡμᾶς.

Why, all the time, bless your heart, the thing apparently was tumbling about our feet from the start and yet we couldn’t see it, but were most ludicrous, like people who sometimes hunt for what they hold in their hands. So we did not turn our eyes upon it, but looked off into the distance, which perhaps was the reason it escaped us.

Πῶς, ἔφη, λέγεις;

What do you mean? he said.

Οὕτως, εἶπον, ὡς δοκοῦμέν μοι καὶ λέγοντες αὐτὸ καὶ

ἀκούοντες πάλαι οὐ μανθάνειν ἡμῶν αὐτῶν, ὅτι ἐλέγομεν

τρόπον τινὰ αὐτό.

This, I replied, that it seems to me that though we were speaking of it and hearing about it all the time we did not understand ourselves or realize that we were speaking of it in a sense.

Μακρόν, ἔφη, τὸ προοίμιον τῷ ἐπιθυμοῦντι ἀκοῦσαι.

That is a tedious prologue, he said, for an eager listener.

433a Ἀλλ', ἦν δ' ἐγώ, ἄκουε εἴ τι ἄρα λέγω. ὃ γὰρ ἐξ ἀρχῆς

ἐθέμεθα δεῖν ποιεῖν διὰ παντός, ὅτε τὴν πόλιν κατῳκίζομεν,

τοῦτό ἐστιν, ὡς ἐμοὶ δοκεῖ, ἤτοι τούτου τι εἶδος ἡ δικαιοσύνη.

ἐθέμεθα δὲ δήπου καὶ πολλάκις ἐλέγομεν, εἰ μέμνησαι, ὅτι

ἕνα ἕκαστον ἓν δέοι ἐπιτηδεύειν τῶν περὶ τὴν πόλιν, εἰς ὃ

αὐτοῦ ἡ φύσις ἐπιτηδειοτάτη πεφυκυῖα εἴη.

Listen then, said I, and learn if there is anything in what I say. For what we laid down in the beginning as a universal requirement when we were founding our city, this I think, or some form of this, is justice. And what we did lay down, and often said, you recall, was that each one man must perform one social service in the state for which his nature is best adapted.

Ἐλέγομεν γάρ.

Yes, we said that.

Καὶ μὴν ὅτι γε τὸ τὰ αὑτοῦ πράττειν καὶ μὴ πολυπραγμονεῖν

δικαιοσύνη ἐστί, καὶ τοῦτο ἄλλων τε πολλῶν

433b ἀκηκόαμεν καὶ αὐτοὶ πολλάκις εἰρήκαμεν.

And again that to do one’s own business and not to be a busybody is justice,

Εἰρήκαμεν γάρ.

is a saying that we have heard from many and have often repeated ourselves. We have.

Τοῦτο τοίνυν, ἦν δ' ἐγώ, ὦ φίλε, κινδυνεύει τρόπον τινὰ

γιγνόμενον ἡ δικαιοσύνη εἶναι, τὸ τὰ αὑτοῦ πράττειν. οἶσθα

ὅθεν τεκμαίρομαι;

This, then, I said, my friend, if taken in a certain sense appears to be justice, this principle of doing one’s own business. Do you know whence I infer this?

Οὐκ, ἀλλὰ λέγ', ἔφη.

No, but tell me, he said.

Δοκεῖ μοι, ἦν δ' ἐγώ, τὸ ὑπόλοιπον ἐν τῇ πόλει ὧν

ἐσκέμμεθα, σωφροσύνης καὶ ἀνδρείας καὶ φρονήσεως, τοῦτο

εἶναι, ὃ πᾶσιν ἐκείνοις τὴν δύναμιν παρέσχεν ὥστε ἐγγενέσθαι,

καὶ ἐγγενομένοις γε σωτηρίαν παρέχειν, ἕωσπερ ἂν

433c ἐνῇ. καίτοι ἔφαμεν δικαιοσύνην ἔσεσθαι τὸ ὑπολειφθὲν

ἐκείνων, εἰ τὰ τρία εὕροιμεν.

I think that this is the remaining virtue in the state after our consideration of soberness, courage, and intelligence, a quality which made it possible for them all to grow up in the body politic and which when they have sprung up preserves them as long as it is present. And I hardly need to remind you that we said that justice would be the residue after we had found the other three.

Καὶ γὰρ ἀνάγκη, ἔφη.

That is an unavoidable conclusion, he said.

Ἀλλὰ μέντοι, ἦν δ' ἐγώ, εἰ δέοι γε κρῖναι τί τὴν πόλιν

ἡμῖν τούτων μάλιστα ἀγαθὴν ἀπεργάσεται ἐγγενόμενον,

δύσκριτον ἂν εἴη πότερον ἡ ὁμοδοξία τῶν ἀρχόντων τε καὶ

ἀρχομένων, ἢ ἡ περὶ δεινῶν τε καὶ μή, ἅττα ἐστί, δόξης

ἐννόμου σωτηρία ἐν τοῖς στρατιώταις ἐγγενομένη, ἢ ἡ ἐν

433d τοῖς ἄρχουσι φρόνησίς τε καὶ φυλακὴ ἐνοῦσα, ἢ τοῦτο

μάλιστα ἀγαθὴν αὐτὴν ποιεῖ ἐνὸν καὶ ἐν παιδὶ καὶ ἐν

γυναικὶ καὶ δούλῳ καὶ ἐλευθέρῳ καὶ δημιουργῷ καὶ ἄρχοντι

καὶ ἀρχομένῳ, ὅτι τὸ αὑτοῦ ἕκαστος εἷς ὢν ἔπραττε καὶ οὐκ

ἐπολυπραγμόνει.

But moreover, said I, if we were required to decide what it is whose indwelling presence will contribute most to making our city good, it would be a difficult decision whether it was the unanimity of rulers and ruled or the conservation in the minds of the soldiers of the convictions produced by law as to what things are or are not to be feared, or the watchful intelligence that resides in the guardians, or whether this is the chief cause of its goodness, the principle embodied in child, woman, slave, free, artisan, ruler, and ruled, that each performed his one task as one man and was not a versatile busybody.

Δύσκριτον, ἔφη· πῶς δ' οὔ;

Hard to decide indeed, he said.

Ἐνάμιλλον ἄρα, ὡς ἔοικε, πρὸς ἀρετὴν πόλεως τῇ τε

σοφίᾳ αὐτῆς καὶ τῇ σωφροσύνῃ καὶ τῇ ἀνδρείᾳ ἡ τοῦ

ἕκαστον ἐν αὐτῇ τὰ αὑτοῦ πράττειν δύναμις.

A thing, then, that in its contribution to the excellence of a state vies with and rivals its wisdom, its soberness, its bravery, is this principle of everyone in it doing his own task.

Καὶ μάλα, ἔφη.

It is indeed, he said.

Οὐκοῦν δικαιοσύνην τό γε τούτοις ἐνάμιλλον ἂν εἰς ἀρετὴν

433e πόλεως θείης;

And is not justice the name you would have to give to the principle that rivals these as conducing to the virtue of state?

Παντάπασι μὲν οὖν.

By all means.

Σκόπει δὴ καὶ τῇδε εἰ οὕτω δόξει· ἆρα τοῖς ἄρχουσιν ἐν

τῇ πόλει τὰς δίκας προστάξεις δικάζειν;

Consider it in this wise too if so you will be convinced. Will you not assign the conduct of lawsuits in your state to the rulers?

Τί μήν;

Of course.

Ἦ ἄλλου οὑτινοσοῦν μᾶλλον ἐφιέμενοι δικάσουσιν ἢ

τούτου, ὅπως ἂν ἕκαστοι μήτ' ἔχωσι τἀλλότρια μήτε τῶν

αὑτῶν στέρωνται;

Will not this be the chief aim of their decisions, that no one shall have what belongs to others or be deprived of his own?

Οὔκ, ἀλλὰ τούτου.

Nothing else but this.

Ὡς δικαίου ὄντος;

On the assumption that this is just?

Ναί.

Yes.

Καὶ ταύτῃ ἄρα πῃ ἡ τοῦ οἰκείου τε καὶ ἑαυτοῦ ἕξις τε καὶ

434a πρᾶξις δικαιοσύνη ἂν ὁμολογοῖτο.

From this point of view too, then, the having and doing of one’s own and what belongs to oneself would admittedly be justice.

Ἔστι ταῦτα.

That is so. Consider now whether you agree with me.

Ἰδὲ δὴ ἐὰν σοὶ ὅπερ ἐμοὶ συνδοκῇ. τέκτων σκυτοτόμου

ἐπιχειρῶν ἔργα ἐργάζεσθαι ἢ σκυτοτόμος τέκτονος, ἢ τὰ

ὄργανα μεταλαμβάνοντες τἀλλήλων ἢ τιμάς, ἢ καὶ ὁ αὐτὸς

ἐπιχειρῶν ἀμφότερα πράττειν, πάντα τἆλλα μεταλλαττόμενα,

ἆρά σοι ἄν τι δοκεῖ μέγα βλάψαι πόλιν;

A carpenter undertaking to do the work of a cobbler or a cobbler of a carpenter or their interchange of one another’s tools or honors or even the attempt of the same man to do both—the confounding of all other functions would not, think you, greatly injure a state, would it?

Οὐ πάνυ, ἔφη.

Not much, he said.

Ἀλλ' ὅταν γε οἶμαι δημιουργὸς ὢν ἤ τις ἄλλος χρηματιστὴς

434b φύσει, ἔπειτα ἐπαιρόμενος ἢ πλούτῳ ἢ πλήθει ἢ ἰσχύι ἢ

ἄλλῳ τῳ τοιούτῳ εἰς τὸ τοῦ πολεμικοῦ εἶδος ἐπιχειρῇ ἰέναι,

ἢ τῶν πολεμικῶν τις εἰς τὸ τοῦ βουλευτικοῦ καὶ φύλακος

ἀνάξιος ὤν, καὶ τὰ ἀλλήλων οὗτοι ὄργανα μεταλαμβάνωσι

καὶ τὰς τιμάς, ἢ ὅταν ὁ αὐτὸς πάντα ταῦτα ἅμα ἐπιχειρῇ

πράττειν, τότε οἶμαι καὶ σοὶ δοκεῖν ταύτην τὴν τούτων

μεταβολὴν καὶ πολυπραγμοσύνην ὄλεθρον εἶναι τῇ πόλει.

But when I fancy one who is by nature an artisan or some kind of money-maker tempted and incited by wealth or command of votes or bodily strength or some similar advantage tries to enter into the class of the soldiers or one of the soldiers into the class of counsellors and guardians, for which he is not fitted, and these interchange their tools and their honors or when the same man undertakes all these functions at once, then, I take it, you too believe that this kind of substitution and meddlesomeness is the ruin of a state.

Παντάπασι μὲν οὖν.

By all means.

Ἡ τριῶν ἄρα ὄντων γενῶν πολυπραγμοσύνη καὶ μεταβολὴ

434c εἰς ἄλληλα μεγίστη τε βλάβη τῇ πόλει καὶ ὀρθότατ' ἂν

προσαγορεύοιτο μάλιστα κακουργία.

The interference with one another’s business, then, of three existent classes and the substitution of the one for the other is the greatest injury to a state and would most rightly be designated as the thing which chiefly works it harm. Precisely so. And the thing that works the greatest harm to one’s own state, will you not pronounce to be injustice?

Κομιδῇ μὲν οὖν.

Of course.

Κακουργίαν δὲ τὴν μεγίστην τῆς ἑαυτοῦ πόλεως οὐκ ἀδικίαν

φήσεις εἶναι;

This, then, is injustice.

Πῶς δ' οὔ;

Again, let us put it in this way.

Τοῦτο μὲν ἄρα ἀδικία. πάλιν δὲ ὧδε λέγωμεν· χρηματιστικοῦ,

ἐπικουρικοῦ, φυλακικοῦ γένους οἰκειοπραγία, ἑκάστου

τούτων τὸ αὑτοῦ πράττοντος ἐν πόλει, τοὐναντίον ἐκείνου

δικαιοσύνη τ' ἂν εἴη καὶ τὴν πόλιν δικαίαν παρέχοι;

The proper functioning of the money-making class, the helpers and the guardians, each doing its own work in the state, being the reverse of that just described, would be justice and would render the city just.

434d Οὐκ ἄλλῃ ἔμοιγε δοκεῖ, ἦ δ' ὅς, ἔχειν ἢ ταύτῃ.

I think the case is thus and no otherwise, said he.

Μηδέν, ἦν δ' ἐγώ, πω πάνυ παγίως αὐτὸ λέγωμεν, ἀλλ'

ἐὰν μὲν ἡμῖν καὶ εἰς ἕνα ἕκαστον τῶν ἀνθρώπων ἰὸν τὸ εἶδος

τοῦτο ὁμολογῆται καὶ ἐκεῖ δικαιοσύνη εἶναι, συγχωρησόμεθα

ἤδη—τί γὰρ καὶ ἐροῦμεν; —εἰ δὲ μή, τότε ἄλλο τι σκεψόμεθα.

νῦν δ' ἐκτελέσωμεν τὴν σκέψιν ἣν ᾠήθημεν, εἰ ἐν μείζονί τινι

τῶν ἐχόντων δικαιοσύνην πρότερον <ἢ> ἐκεῖ ἐπιχειρήσαιμεν

θεάσασθαι, ῥᾷον ἂν ἐν ἑνὶ ἀνθρώπῳ κατιδεῖν οἷόν ἐστιν. καὶ

434e ἔδοξε δὴ ἡμῖν τοῦτο εἶναι πόλις, καὶ οὕτω ᾠκίζομεν ὡς

ἐδυνάμεθα ἀρίστην, εὖ εἰδότες ὅτι ἔν γε τῇ ἀγαθῇ ἂν εἴη.

ὃ οὖν ἡμῖν ἐκεῖ ἐφάνη, ἐπαναφέρωμεν εἰς τὸν ἕνα, κἂν μὲν

ὁμολογῆται, καλῶς ἕξει· ἐὰν δέ τι ἄλλο ἐν τῷ ἑνὶ ἐμφαίνηται,

πάλιν ἐπανιόντες ἐπὶ τὴν πόλιν βασανιοῦμεν, καὶ

435a τάχ' ἂν παρ' ἄλληλα σκοποῦντες καὶ τρίβοντες, ὥσπερ ἐκ

πυρείων ἐκλάμψαι ποιήσαιμεν τὴν δικαιοσύνην· καὶ φανερὰν

γενομένην βεβαιωσόμεθα αὐτὴν παρ' ἡμῖν αὐτοῖς.

Let us not yet affirm it quite fixedly, I said, but if this form when applied to the individual man, accepted there also as a definition of justice, we will then concede the point—for what else will there be to say? But if not, then we will look for something else. But now let us work out the inquiry in which we supposed that, if we found some larger thing that contained justice and viewed it there, we should more easily discover its nature in the individual man. And we agreed that this larger thing is the city, and so we constructed the best city in our power, well knowing that in the good city it would of course be found. What, then, we thought we saw there we must refer back to the individual and, if it is confirmed, all will be well.
But if something different manifests itself in the individual, we will return again to the state and test it there and it may be that, by examining them side by side and rubbing them against one another, as it were from the fire-sticks we may cause the spark of justice to flash forth, and when it is thus revealed confirm it in our own minds.

Ἀλλ', ἔφη, καθ' ὁδόν τε λέγεις καὶ ποιεῖν χρὴ οὕτως.

Well, he said, that seems a sound method and that is what we must do.

Ἆρ' οὖν, ἦν δ' ἐγώ, ὅ γε ταὐτὸν ἄν τις προσείποι μεῖζόν

τε καὶ ἔλαττον, ἀνόμοιον τυγχάνει ὂν ταύτῃ ᾗ ταὐτὸν

προσαγορεύεται, ἢ ὅμοιον;

Then, said I, if you call a thing by the same name whether it is big or little, is it unlike in the way in which it is called the same or like?

Ὅμοιον, ἔφη.

Like, he said.

435b Καὶ δίκαιος ἄρα ἀνὴρ δικαίας πόλεως κατ' αὐτὸ τὸ τῆς

δικαιοσύνης εἶδος οὐδὲν διοίσει, ἀλλ' ὅμοιος ἔσται.

Then a just man too will not differ at all from a just city in respect of the very form of justice, but will be like it.

Ὅμοιος, ἔφη.

Yes, like.

Ἀλλὰ μέντοι πόλις γε ἔδοξεν εἶναι δικαία ὅτε ἐν αὐτῇ

τριττὰ γένη φύσεων ἐνόντα τὸ αὑτῶν ἕκαστον ἔπραττεν,

σώφρων δὲ αὖ καὶ ἀνδρεία καὶ σοφὴ διὰ τῶν αὐτῶν τούτων

γενῶν ἄλλ' ἄττα πάθη τε καὶ ἕξεις.

But now the city was thought to be just because three natural kinds existing in it performed each its own function, and again it was sober, brave, and wise because of certain other affections and habits of these three kinds.

Ἀληθῆ, ἔφη.

True, he said.

Καὶ τὸν ἕνα ἄρα, ὦ φίλε, οὕτως ἀξιώσομεν, τὰ αὐτὰ ταῦτα

435c εἴδη ἐν τῇ αὑτοῦ ψυχῇ ἔχοντα, διὰ τὰ αὐτὰ πάθη ἐκείνοις

τῶν αὐτῶν ὀνομάτων ὀρθῶς ἀξιοῦσθαι τῇ πόλει.

Then, my friend, we shall thus expect the individual also to have these same forms in his soul, and by reason of identical affections of these with those in the city to receive properly the same appellations.

Πᾶσα ἀνάγκη, ἔφη.

Inevitable, he said.

Εἰς φαῦλόν γε αὖ, ἦν δ' ἐγώ, ὦ θαυμάσιε, σκέμμα

ἐμπεπτώκαμεν περὶ ψυχῆς, εἴτε ἔχει τὰ τρία εἴδη ταῦτα ἐν

αὑτῇ εἴτε μή.

Goodness gracious, said I, here is another trifling inquiry into which we have plunged, the question whether the soul really contains these three forms in itself or not.

Οὐ πάνυ μοι δοκοῦμεν, ἔφη, εἰς φαῦλον· ἴσως γάρ, ὦ

Σώκρατες, τὸ λεγόμενον ἀληθές, ὅτι χαλεπὰ τὰ καλά.

It does not seem to me at all trifling, he said, for perhaps, Socrates, the saying is true that ’fine things are difficult.’

Φαίνεται, ἦν δ' ἐγώ. καὶ εὖ γ' ἴσθι, ὦ Γλαύκων, ὡς ἡ

435d ἐμὴ δόξα, ἀκριβῶς μὲν τοῦτο ἐκ τοιούτων μεθόδων, οἵαις

νῦν ἐν τοῖς λόγοις χρώμεθα, οὐ μή ποτε λάβωμεν—

ἄλλη γὰρ μακροτέρα καὶ πλείων ὁδὸς ἡ ἐπὶ τοῦτο ἄγουσα

—ἴσως μέντοι τῶν γε προειρημένων τε καὶ προεσκεμμένων

ἀξίως.

Apparently, said I; and let me tell you, Glaucon, that in my opinion we shall never in the world apprehend this matter from such methods as we are now employing in discussion. For there is another longer and harder way that conducts to this. Yet we may perhaps discuss it on the level of previous statements and inquiries.

Οὐκοῦν ἀγαπητόν; ἔφη· ἐμοὶ μὲν γὰρ ἔν γε τῷ παρόντι

ἱκανῶς ἂν ἔχοι.

May we acquiesce in that? he said. I for my part should be quite satisfied with that for the present.

Ἀλλὰ μέντοι, εἶπον, ἔμοιγε καὶ πάνυ ἐξαρκέσει.

And I surely should be more than satisfied, I replied.

Μὴ τοίνυν ἀποκάμῃς, ἔφη, ἀλλὰ σκόπει.

Don’t you weary then, he said, but go on with the inquiry.

435e Ἆρ' οὖν ἡμῖν, ἦν δ' ἐγώ, πολλὴ ἀνάγκη ὁμολογεῖν ὅτι γε

τὰ αὐτὰ ἐν ἑκάστῳ ἔνεστιν ἡμῶν εἴδη τε καὶ ἤθη ἅπερ

ἐν τῇ πόλει; οὐ γάρ που ἄλλοθεν ἐκεῖσε ἀφῖκται. γελοῖον

γὰρ ἂν εἴη εἴ τις οἰηθείη τὸ θυμοειδὲς μὴ ἐκ τῶν ἰδιωτῶν

ἐν ταῖς πόλεσιν ἐγγεγονέναι, οἳ δὴ καὶ ἔχουσι ταύτην τὴν

αἰτίαν, οἷον οἱ κατὰ τὴν Θρᾴκην τε καὶ Σκυθικὴν καὶ σχεδόν

τι κατὰ τὸν ἄνω τόπον, ἢ τὸ φιλομαθές, ὃ δὴ τὸν παρ' ἡμῖν

436a μάλιστ' ἄν τις αἰτιάσαιτο τόπον, ἢ τὸ φιλοχρήματον τὸ περὶ

τούς τε Φοίνικας εἶναι καὶ τοὺς κατὰ Αἴγυπτον φαίη τις ἂν

οὐχ ἥκιστα.

Is it not, then, said I, impossible for us to avoid admitting this much, that the same forms and qualities are to be found in each one of us that are in the state? They could not get there from any other source.
It would be absurd to suppose that the element of high spirit was not derived in states from the private citizens who are reputed to have this quality as the populations of the Thracian and Scythian lands and generally of northern regions; or the quality of love of knowledge, which would chiefly be attributed to the region where we dwell, or the love of money which we might say is not least likely to be found in Phoenicians and the population of Egypt.

Καὶ μάλα, ἔφη.

One certainly might, he replied.

Τοῦτο μὲν δὴ οὕτως ἔχει, ἦν δ' ἐγώ, καὶ οὐδὲν χαλεπὸν

γνῶναι.

This is the fact then, said I, and there is no difficulty in recognizing it.

Οὐ δῆτα.

Certainly not.

Τόδε δὲ ἤδη χαλεπόν, εἰ τῷ αὐτῷ τούτῳ ἕκαστα πράττομεν

ἢ τρισὶν οὖσιν ἄλλο ἄλλῳ· μανθάνομεν μὲν ἑτέρῳ,

θυμούμεθα δὲ ἄλλῳ τῶν ἐν ἡμῖν, ἐπιθυμοῦμεν δ' αὖ τρίτῳ τινὶ

τῶν περὶ τὴν τροφήν τε καὶ γέννησιν ἡδονῶν καὶ ὅσα τούτων

436b ἀδελφά, ἢ ὅλῃ τῇ ψυχῇ καθ' ἕκαστον αὐτῶν πράττομεν,

ὅταν ὁρμήσωμεν. ταῦτ' ἔσται τὰ χαλεπὰ διορίσασθαι ἀξίως

λόγου.

But the matter begins to be difficult when you ask whether we do all these things with the same thing or whether there are three things and we do one thing with one and one with another—learn with one part of ourselves, feel anger with another, and with yet a third desire the pleasures of nutrition and generation and their kind, or whether it is with the entire soul that we function in each case when we once begin. That is what is really hard to determine properly.

Καὶ ἐμοὶ δοκεῖ, ἔφη.

I think so too, he said.

Ὧδε τοίνυν ἐπιχειρῶμεν αὐτὰ ὁρίζεσθαι, εἴτε τὰ αὐτὰ

ἀλλήλοις εἴτε ἕτερά ἐστι.

Let us then attempt to define the boundary and decide whether they are identical with one another in this way.

Πῶς;

How?

Δῆλον ὅτι ταὐτὸν τἀναντία ποιεῖν ἢ πάσχειν κατὰ ταὐτόν

γε καὶ πρὸς ταὐτὸν οὐκ ἐθελήσει ἅμα, ὥστε ἄν που εὑρίσκωμεν

ἐν αὐτοῖς ταῦτα γιγνόμενα, εἰσόμεθα ὅτι οὐ ταὐτὸν

436c ἦν ἀλλὰ πλείω.

It is obvious that the same thing will never do or suffer opposites in the same respect in relation to the same thing and at the same time. So that if ever we find these contradictions in the functions of the mind we shall know that it was not the same thing functioning but a plurality.

Εἶεν.

Very well.

Σκόπει δὴ ὃ λέγω.

Consider, then, what I am saying.

Λέγε, ἔφη.

Say on, he replied.

Ἑστάναι, εἶπον, καὶ κινεῖσθαι τὸ αὐτὸ ἅμα κατὰ τὸ αὐτὸ

ἆρα δυνατόν;

Is it possible for the same thing at the same time in the same respect to be at rest and in motion?

Οὐδαμῶς.

By no means.

Ἔτι τοίνυν ἀκριβέστερον ὁμολογησώμεθα, μή πῃ προϊόντες

ἀμφισβητήσωμεν. εἰ γάρ τις λέγοι ἄνθρωπον ἑστηκότα,

κινοῦντα δὲ τὰς χεῖράς τε καὶ τὴν κεφαλήν, ὅτι ὁ αὐτὸς

ἕστηκέ τε καὶ κινεῖται ἅμα, οὐκ ἂν οἶμαι ἀξιοῖμεν οὕτω

436d λέγειν δεῖν, ἀλλ' ὅτι τὸ μέν τι αὐτοῦ ἕστηκε, τὸ δὲ κινεῖται.

οὐχ οὕτω;

Let us have our understanding still more precise, lest as we proceed we become involved in dispute. If anyone should say of a man standing still but moving his hands and head that the same man is at the same time at rest and in motion we should not, I take it, regard that as the right way of expressing it, but rather that a part of him is at rest and a part in motion. Is not that so?

Οὕτω.

It is.

Οὐκοῦν καὶ εἰ ἔτι μᾶλλον χαριεντίζοιτο ὁ ταῦτα λέγων,

κομψευόμενος ὡς οἵ γε στρόβιλοι ὅλοι ἑστᾶσί τε ἅμα καὶ

κινοῦνται, ὅταν ἐν τῷ αὐτῷ πήξαντες τὸ κέντρον περιφέρωνται,

ἢ καὶ ἄλλο τι κύκλῳ περιιὸν ἐν τῇ αὐτῇ ἕδρᾳ

τοῦτο δρᾷ, οὐκ ἂν ἀποδεχοίμεθα, ὡς οὐ κατὰ ταὐτὰ ἑαυτῶν

436e τὰ τοιαῦτα τότε μενόντων τε καὶ φερομένων, ἀλλὰ φαῖμεν

ἂν ἔχειν αὐτὰ εὐθύ τε καὶ περιφερὲς ἐν αὑτοῖς, καὶ κατὰ μὲν

τὸ εὐθὺ ἑστάναι—οὐδαμῇ γὰρ ἀποκλίνειν—κατὰ δὲ τὸ περιφερὲς

κύκλῳ κινεῖσθαι, καὶ ὅταν δὲ τὴν εὐθυωρίαν ἢ εἰς

δεξιὰν ἢ εἰς ἀριστερὰν ἢ εἰς τὸ πρόσθεν ἢ εἰς τὸ ὄπισθεν

ἐγκλίνῃ ἅμα περιφερόμενον, τότε οὐδαμῇ [ἔστιν] ἑστάναι.

Then if the disputant should carry the jest still further with the subtlety that tops at any rate stand still as a whole at the same time that they are in motion when with the peg fixed in one point they revolve, and that the same is true of any other case of circular motion about the same spot—we should reject the statement on the ground that the repose and the movement in such cases were not in relation to the same parts of the objects, but we would say that there was a straight line and a circumference in them and that in respect of the straight line they are standing still since they do not incline to either side, but in respect of the circumference they move in a circle; but that when as they revolve they incline the perpendicular to right or left or forward or back, then they are in no wise at rest.

Καὶ ὀρθῶς γε, ἔφη.

And that would be right, he said.

Οὐδὲν ἄρα ἡμᾶς τῶν τοιούτων λεγόμενον ἐκπλήξει, οὐδὲ

μᾶλλόν τι πείσει ὥς ποτέ τι ἂν τὸ αὐτὸ ὂν ἅμα κατὰ

437a τὸ αὐτὸ πρὸς τὸ αὐτὸ τἀναντία πάθοι ἢ καὶ εἴη ἢ καὶ

ποιήσειεν.

No such remarks then will disconcert us or any whit the more make us believe that it is ever possible for the same thing at the same time in the same respect and the same relation to suffer, be, or do opposites.

Οὔκουν ἐμέ γε, ἔφη.

They will not me, I am sure, said he.

Ἀλλ' ὅμως, ἦν δ' ἐγώ, ἵνα μὴ ἀναγκαζώμεθα πάσας τὰς

τοιαύτας ἀμφισβητήσεις ἐπεξιόντες καὶ βεβαιούμενοι ὡς

οὐκ ἀληθεῖς οὔσας μηκύνειν, ὑποθέμενοι ὡς τούτου οὕτως

ἔχοντος εἰς τὸ πρόσθεν προΐωμεν, ὁμολογήσαντες, ἐάν ποτε

ἄλλῃ φανῇ ταῦτα ἢ ταύτῃ, πάντα ἡμῖν τὰ ἀπὸ τούτου

συμβαίνοντα λελυμένα ἔσεσθαι.

All the same, said I, that we may not be forced to examine at tedious length the entire list of such contentions and convince ourselves that they are false, let us proceed on the hypothesis that this is so, with the understanding that, if it ever appear otherwise, everything that results from the assumption shall be invalidated.

Ἀλλὰ χρή, ἔφη, ταῦτα ποιεῖν.

That is what we must do, he said.

437b Ἆρ' <ἂν> οὖν, ἦν δ' ἐγώ, τὸ ἐπινεύειν τῷ ἀνανεύειν καὶ τὸ

ἐφίεσθαί τινος λαβεῖν τῷ ἀπαρνεῖσθαι καὶ τὸ προσάγεσθαι

τῷ ἀπωθεῖσθαι, πάντα τὰ τοιαῦτα τῶν ἐναντίων ἀλλήλοις

θείης εἴτε ποιημάτων εἴτε παθημάτων; οὐδὲν γὰρ ταύτῃ

διοίσει.

Will you not then, said I, set down as opposed to one another assent and dissent, and the endeavor after a thing to the rejection of it, and embracing to repelling—do not these and all things like these belong to the class of opposite actions or passions; it will make no difference which?

Ἀλλ', ἦ δ' ὅς, τῶν ἐναντίων.

None, said he, but they are opposites.

Τί οὖν; ἦν δ' ἐγώ· διψῆν καὶ πεινῆν καὶ ὅλως τὰς ἐπιθυμίας,

καὶ αὖ τὸ ἐθέλειν καὶ τὸ βούλεσθαι, οὐ πάντα ταῦτα

437c εἰς ἐκεῖνά ποι ἂν θείης τὰ εἴδη τὰ νυνδὴ λεχθέντα; οἷον

ἀεὶ τὴν τοῦ ἐπιθυμοῦντος ψυχὴν οὐχὶ ἤτοι ἐφίεσθαι φήσεις

ἐκείνου οὗ ἂν ἐπιθυμῇ, ἢ προσάγεσθαι τοῦτο ὃ ἂν βούληταί οἱ

γενέσθαι, ἢ αὖ, καθ' ὅσον ἐθέλει τί οἱ πορισθῆναι, ἐπινεύειν

τοῦτο πρὸς αὑτὴν ὥσπερ τινὸς ἐρωτῶντος, ἐπορεγομένην

αὐτοῦ τῆς γενέσεως;

What then, said I, of thirst and hunger and the appetites generally, and again consenting and willing, would you not put them all somewhere in the classes just described? Will you not say, for example, that the soul of one who desires either strives for that which he desires or draws towards its embrace what it wishes to accrue to it; or again, in so far as it wills that anything be presented to it, nods assent to itself thereon as if someone put the question, striving towards its attainment?

Ἔγωγε.

I would say so, he said.

Τί δέ; τὸ ἀβουλεῖν καὶ μὴ ἐθέλειν μηδ' ἐπιθυμεῖν οὐκ

εἰς τὸ ἀπωθεῖν καὶ ἀπελαύνειν ἀπ' αὐτῆς καὶ εἰς ἅπαντα

τἀναντία ἐκείνοις θήσομεν;

But what of not-willing and not consenting nor yet desiring, shall we not put these under the soul’s rejection and repulsion from itself and generally into the opposite class from all the former?

437d Πῶς γὰρ οὔ;

Of course.

Τούτων δὴ οὕτως ἐχόντων ἐπιθυμιῶν τι φήσομεν εἶναι

εἶδος, καὶ ἐναργεστάτας αὐτῶν τούτων ἥν τε δίψαν καλοῦμεν

καὶ ἣν πεῖναν;

This being so, shall we say that the desires constitute a class and that the most conspicuous members of that class are what we call thirst and hunger?

Φήσομεν, ἦ δ' ὅς.

We shall, said he.

Οὐκοῦν τὴν μὲν ποτοῦ, τὴν δ' ἐδωδῆς;

Is not the one desire of drink, the other of food?

Ναί.

Yes.

Ἆρ' οὖν, καθ' ὅσον δίψα ἐστί, πλέονος ἄν τινος ἢ οὗ

λέγομεν ἐπιθυμία ἐν τῇ ψυχῇ εἴη, οἷον δίψα ἐστὶ δίψα

ἆρά γε θερμοῦ ποτοῦ ἢ ψυχροῦ, ἢ πολλοῦ ἢ ὀλίγου, ἢ καὶ

ἑνὶ λόγῳ ποιοῦ τινος πώματος; ἢ ἐὰν μέν τις θερμότης τῷ

437e δίψει προσῇ, τὴν τοῦ ψυχροῦ ἐπιθυμίαν προσπαρέχοιτ' ἄν,

ἐὰν δὲ ψυχρότης, τὴν τοῦ θερμοῦ; ἐὰν δὲ διὰ πλήθους

παρουσίαν πολλὴ ἡ δίψα ᾖ, τὴν τοῦ πολλοῦ παρέξεται, ἐὰν

δὲ ὀλίγη, τὴν τοῦ ὀλίγου; αὐτὸ δὲ τὸ διψῆν οὐ μή ποτε

ἄλλου γένηται ἐπιθυμία ἢ οὗπερ πέφυκεν, αὐτοῦ πώματος,

καὶ αὖ τὸ πεινῆν βρώματος;

Then in so far as it is thirst, would it be of anything more than that of which we say it is a desire in the soul? I mean is thirst thirst for hot drink or cold or much or little or in a word for a draught of any particular quality, or is it the fact that if heat is attached to the thirst it would further render the desire—a desire of cold, and if cold of hot? But if owing to the presence of muchness the thirst is much it would render it a thirst for much and if little for little. But mere thirst will never be desire of anything else than that of which it is its nature to be, mere drink, and so hunger of food.

Οὕτως, ἔφη, αὐτή γε ἡ ἐπιθυμία ἑκάστη αὐτοῦ μόνον

ἑκάστου οὗ πέφυκεν, τοῦ δὲ τοίου ἢ τοίου τὰ προσγιγνόμενα.

That is so, he said; each desire in itself is of that thing only of which it is its nature to be. The epithets belong to the quality—such or such.

438a Μήτοι τις, ἦν δ' ἐγώ, ἀσκέπτους ἡμᾶς ὄντας θορυβήσῃ,

ὡς οὐδεὶς ποτοῦ ἐπιθυμεῖ ἀλλὰ χρηστοῦ ποτοῦ, καὶ οὐ σίτου

ἀλλὰ χρηστοῦ σίτου. πάντες γὰρ ἄρα τῶν ἀγαθῶν ἐπιθυμοῦσιν·

εἰ οὖν ἡ δίψα ἐπιθυμία ἐστί, χρηστοῦ ἂν εἴη εἴτε

πώματος εἴτε ἄλλου ὅτου ἐστὶν ἐπιθυμία, καὶ αἱ ἄλλαι οὕτω.

Let no one then, said I, disconcert us when off our guard with the objection that everybody desires not drink but good drink and not food but good food, because (the argument will run) all men desire good, and so, if thirst is desire, it would be of good drink or of good whatsoever it is; and so similarly of other desires.

Ἴσως γὰρ ἄν, ἔφη, δοκοῖ τι λέγειν ὁ ταῦτα λέγων.

Why, he said, there perhaps would seem to be something in that objection.

Ἀλλὰ μέντοι, ἦν δ' ἐγώ, ὅσα γ' ἐστὶ τοιαῦτα οἷα εἶναί

438b του, τὰ μὲν ποιὰ ἄττα ποιοῦ τινός ἐστιν, ὡς ἐμοὶ δοκεῖ,

τὰ δ' αὐτὰ ἕκαστα αὐτοῦ ἑκάστου μόνον.

But I need hardly remind you, said I, that of relative terms those that are somehow qualified are related to a qualified correlate, those that are severally just themselves to a correlate that is just itself.

Οὐκ ἔμαθον, ἔφη.

I don’t understand, he said.

Οὐκ ἔμαθες, ἔφην, ὅτι τὸ μεῖζον τοιοῦτόν ἐστιν οἷον

τινὸς εἶναι μεῖζον;

Don’t you understand, said I, that the greater is such as to be greater than something?

Πάνυ γε.

Certainly.

Οὐκοῦν τοῦ ἐλάττονος;

Is it not than the less?

Ναί.

Yes.

Τὸ δέ γε πολὺ μεῖζον πολὺ ἐλάττονος. ἦ γάρ;

But the much greater than the much less. Is that not so?

Ναί.

Yes.

Ἆρ' οὖν καὶ τὸ ποτὲ μεῖζον ποτὲ ἐλάττονος, καὶ τὸ

ἐσόμενον μεῖζον ἐσομένου ἐλάττονος;

And may we add the one time greater than the one time less and that which will be greater than that which will be less?

Ἀλλὰ τί μήν; ἦ δ' ὅς.

Surely.

438c Καὶ τὰ πλείω δὴ πρὸς τὰ ἐλάττω καὶ τὰ διπλάσια πρὸς τὰ

ἡμίσεα καὶ πάντα τὰ τοιαῦτα, καὶ αὖ βαρύτερα πρὸς κουφότερα

καὶ θάττω πρὸς τὰ βραδύτερα, καὶ ἔτι γε τὰ θερμὰ

πρὸς τὰ ψυχρὰ καὶ πάντα τὰ τούτοις ὅμοια ἆρ' οὐχ οὕτως ἔχει;

And similarly of the more towards the fewer, and the double towards the half and of all like cases, and again of the heavier towards the lighter, the swifter towards the slower, and yet again of the hot towards the cold and all cases of that kind, does not the same hold?

Πάνυ μὲν οὖν.

By all means. But what of the sciences? Is not the way of it the same?

Τί δὲ τὰ περὶ τὰς ἐπιστήμας; οὐχ ὁ αὐτὸς τρόπος;

ἐπιστήμη μὲν αὐτὴ μαθήματος αὐτοῦ ἐπιστήμη ἐστὶν ἢ ὅτου

δὴ δεῖ θεῖναι τὴν ἐπιστήμην, ἐπιστήμη δέ τις καὶ ποιά τις

438d ποιοῦ τινος καὶ τινός. λέγω δὲ τὸ τοιόνδε· οὐκ ἐπειδὴ

οἰκίας ἐργασίας ἐπιστήμη ἐγένετο, διήνεγκε τῶν ἄλλων

ἐπιστημῶν, ὥστε οἰκοδομικὴ κληθῆναι;

Science which is just that, is of knowledge which is just that, or is of whatsoever we must assume the correlate of science to be. But a particular science of a particular kind is of some particular thing of a particular kind. I mean something like this: As there was a science of making a house it differed from other sciences so as to be named architecture.

Τί μήν;

Certainly.

Ἆρ' οὐ τῷ ποιά τις εἶναι, οἵα ἑτέρα οὐδεμία τῶν

ἄλλων;

Was not this by reason of its being of a certain kind such as no other of all the rest?

Ναί.

Yes.

Οὐκοῦν ἐπειδὴ ποιοῦ τινος, καὶ αὐτὴ ποιά τις ἐγένετο;

καὶ αἱ ἄλλαι οὕτω τέχναι τε καὶ ἐπιστῆμαι;

And was it not because it was of something of a certain kind that it itself became a certain kind of science? And similarly of the other arts and sciences?

Ἔστιν οὕτω.

That is so.

Τοῦτο τοίνυν, ἦν δ' ἐγώ, φάθι με τότε βούλεσθαι λέγειν,

εἰ ἄρα νῦν ἔμαθες, ὅτι ὅσα ἐστὶν οἷα εἶναί του, αὐτὰ μὲν

μόνα αὐτῶν μόνων ἐστίν, τῶν δὲ ποιῶν τινων ποιὰ ἄττα.

438e καὶ οὔ τι λέγω, ὡς, οἵων ἂν ᾖ, τοιαῦτα καὶ ἔστιν, ὡς ἄρα

καὶ τῶν ὑγιεινῶν καὶ νοσωδῶν ἡ ἐπιστήμη ὑγιεινὴ καὶ

νοσώδης καὶ τῶν κακῶν καὶ τῶν ἀγαθῶν κακὴ καὶ ἀγαθή·

ἀλλ' ἐπειδὴ οὐκ αὐτοῦ οὗπερ ἐπιστήμη ἐστὶν ἐγένετο ἐπιστήμη,

ἀλλὰ ποιοῦ τινος, τοῦτο δ' ἦν ὑγιεινὸν καὶ νοσῶδες,

ποιὰ δή τις συνέβη καὶ αὐτὴ γενέσθαι, καὶ τοῦτο αὐτὴν

ἐποίησεν μηκέτι ἐπιστήμην ἁπλῶς καλεῖσθαι, ἀλλὰ τοῦ ποιοῦ

τινος προσγενομένου ἰατρικήν.

This then, said I, if haply you now understand, is what you must say I then meant, by the statement that of all things that are such as to be of something those that are just themselves only are of things just themselves only, but things of a certain kind are of things of a kind. And I don’t at all mean that they are of the same kind as the things of which they are, so that we are to suppose that the science of health and disease is a healthy and diseased science and that of evil and good, evil and good. I only mean that as science became the science not of just the thing of which science is but of some particular kind of thing, namely, of health and disease, the result was that it itself became some kind of science and this caused it to be no longer called simply science but with the addition of the particular kind, medical science.

Ἔμαθον, ἔφη, καί μοι δοκεῖ οὕτως ἔχειν.

I understand, he said, and agree that it is so.

439a Τὸ δὲ δὴ δίψος, ἦν δ' ἐγώ, οὐ τούτων θήσεις τῶν τινὸς

εἶναι τοῦτο ὅπερ ἐστίν; ἔστι δὲ δήπου δίψος—

To return to thirst, then, said I, will you not class it with the things that are of something and say that it is what it is in relation to something—and it is, I presume, thirst?

Ἔγωγε, ἦ δ' ὅς· πώματός γε.

I will, said he, —namely of drink.

Οὐκοῦν ποιοῦ μέν τινος πώματος ποιόν τι καὶ δίψος,

δίψος δ' οὖν αὐτὸ οὔτε πολλοῦ οὔτε ὀλίγου, οὔτε ἀγαθοῦ

οὔτε κακοῦ, οὐδ' ἑνὶ λόγῳ ποιοῦ τινος, ἀλλ' αὐτοῦ πώματος

μόνον αὐτὸ δίψος πέφυκεν;

Then if the drink is of a certain kind, so is the thirst, but thirst that is just thirst is neither of much nor little nor good nor bad, nor in a word of any kind, but just thirst is naturally of just drink only.

Παντάπασι μὲν οὖν.

By all means.

Τοῦ διψῶντος ἄρα ἡ ψυχή, καθ' ὅσον διψῇ, οὐκ ἄλλο

439b τι βούλεται ἢ πιεῖν, καὶ τούτου ὀρέγεται καὶ ἐπὶ τοῦτο ὁρμᾷ.

The soul of the thirsty then, in so far as it thirsts, wishes nothing else than to drink, and

Δῆλον δή.

yearns for this and its impulse is towards this. Obviously.

Οὐκοῦν εἴ ποτέ τι αὐτὴν ἀνθέλκει διψῶσαν, ἕτερον ἄν τι

ἐν αὐτῇ εἴη αὐτοῦ τοῦ διψῶντος καὶ ἄγοντος ὥσπερ θηρίον

ἐπὶ τὸ πιεῖν; οὐ γὰρ δή, φαμέν, τό γε αὐτὸ τῷ αὐτῷ ἑαυτοῦ

περὶ τὸ αὐτὸ ἅμ' ἂ<ν> τἀναντία πράττοι.

Then if anything draws it back when thirsty it must be something different in it from that which thirsts and drives it like a beast to drink. For it cannot be, we say, that the same thing with the same part of itself at the same time acts in opposite ways about the same thing.

Οὐ γὰρ οὖν.

We must admit that it does not.

Ὥσπερ γε οἶμαι τοῦ τοξότου οὐ καλῶς ἔχει λέγειν ὅτι

αὐτοῦ ἅμα αἱ χεῖρες τὸ τόξον ἀπωθοῦνταί τε καὶ προσέλκονται,

ἀλλ' ὅτι ἄλλη μὲν ἡ ἀπωθοῦσα χείρ, ἑτέρα δὲ ἡ

προσαγομένη.

So I fancy it is not well said of the archer that his hands at the same time thrust away the bow and draw it nigh, but we should rather say that there is one hand that puts it away and another that draws it to.

439c Παντάπασι μὲν οὖν, ἔφη.

By all means, he said.

Πότερον δὴ φῶμέν τινας ἔστιν ὅτε διψῶντας οὐκ ἐθέλειν

πιεῖν;

Are we to say, then, that some men sometimes though thirsty refuse to drink?

Καὶ μάλα γ', ἔφη, πολλοὺς καὶ πολλάκις.

We are indeed, he said, many and often.

Τί οὖν, ἔφην ἐγώ, φαίη τις ἂν τούτων πέρι; οὐκ ἐνεῖναι

μὲν ἐν τῇ ψυχῇ αὐτῶν τὸ κελεῦον, ἐνεῖναι δὲ τὸ κωλῦον

πιεῖν, ἄλλο ὂν καὶ κρατοῦν τοῦ κελεύοντος;

What then, said I, should one affirm about them? Is it not that there is something in the soul that bids them drink and a something that forbids, a different something that masters that which bids?

Ἔμοιγε, ἔφη, δοκεῖ.

I think so.

Ἆρ' οὖν οὐ τὸ μὲν κωλῦον τὰ τοιαῦτα ἐγγίγνεται, ὅταν

439d ἐγγένηται, ἐκ λογισμοῦ, τὰ δὲ ἄγοντα καὶ ἕλκοντα διὰ

παθημάτων τε καὶ νοσημάτων παραγίγνεται;

And is it not the fact that that which inhibits such actions arises when it arises from the calculations of reason, but the impulses which draw and drag come through affections and diseases?

Φαίνεται.

Apparently.

Οὐ δὴ ἀλόγως, ἦν δ' ἐγώ, ἀξιώσομεν αὐτὰ διττά τε καὶ

ἕτερα ἀλλήλων εἶναι, τὸ μὲν ᾧ λογίζεται λογιστικὸν προςαγορεύοντες

τῆς ψυχῆς, τὸ δὲ ᾧ ἐρᾷ τε καὶ πεινῇ καὶ

διψῇ καὶ περὶ τὰς ἄλλας ἐπιθυμίας ἐπτόηται ἀλόγιστόν

τε καὶ ἐπιθυμητικόν, πληρώσεών τινων καὶ ἡδονῶν ἑταῖρον.

Not unreasonably, said I, shall we claim that they are two and different from one another, naming that in the soul whereby it reckons and reasons the rational and that with which it loves, hungers, thirsts, and feels the flutter and titillation of other desires, the irrational and appetitive—companion of various repletions and pleasures.

439e Οὔκ, ἀλλ' εἰκότως, ἔφη, ἡγοίμεθ' ἂν οὕτως.

It would not be unreasonable but quite natural, he said, for us to think this.

Ταῦτα μὲν τοίνυν, ἦν δ' ἐγώ, δύο ἡμῖν ὡρίσθω εἴδη ἐν

ψυχῇ ἐνόντα· τὸ δὲ δὴ τοῦ θυμοῦ καὶ ᾧ θυμούμεθα πότερον

τρίτον, ἢ τούτων ποτέρῳ ἂν εἴη ὁμοφυές;

These two forms, then, let us assume to have been marked off as actually existing in the soul. But now the Thumos or principle of high spirit, that with which we feel anger, is it a third, or would it be identical in nature with one of these?

Ἴσως, ἔφη, τῷ ἑτέρῳ, τῷ ἐπιθυμητικῷ.

Perhaps, he said, with one of these, the appetitive.

Ἀλλ', ἦν δ' ἐγώ, ποτὲ ἀκούσας τι† πιστεύω τούτῳ·

ὡς ἄρα Λεόντιος ὁ Ἀγλαΐωνος ἀνιὼν ἐκ Πειραιῶς ὑπὸ τὸ

βόρειον τεῖχος ἐκτός, αἰσθόμενος νεκροὺς παρὰ τῷ δημίῳ

κειμένους, ἅμα μὲν ἰδεῖν ἐπιθυμοῖ, ἅμα δὲ αὖ δυσχεραίνοι

καὶ ἀποτρέποι ἑαυτόν, καὶ τέως μὲν μάχοιτό τε καὶ παρακαλύπτοιτο,

440a κρατούμενος δ' οὖν ὑπὸ τῆς ἐπιθυμίας, διελκύσας

τοὺς ὀφθαλμούς, προσδραμὼν πρὸς τοὺς νεκρούς, "Ἰδοὺ ὑμῖν,"

ἔφη, "ὦ κακοδαίμονες, ἐμπλήσθητε τοῦ καλοῦ θεάματος."

But, I said, I once heard a story which I believe, that Leontius the son of Aglaion, on his way up from the Peiraeus under the outer side of the northern wall, becoming aware of dead bodies that lay at the place of public execution at the same time felt a desire to see them and a repugnance and aversion, and that for a time he resisted and veiled his head, but overpowered in despite of all by his desire, with wide staring eyes he rushed up to the corpses and cried, There, ye wretches, take your fill of the fine spectacle!

Ἤκουσα, ἔφη, καὶ αὐτός.

I too, he said, have heard the story.

Οὗτος μέντοι, ἔφην, ὁ λόγος σημαίνει τὴν ὀργὴν πολεμεῖν

ἐνίοτε ταῖς ἐπιθυμίαις ὡς ἄλλο ὂν ἄλλῳ.

Yet, surely, this anecdote, I said, signifies that the principle of anger sometimes fights against desires as an alien thing against an alien.

Σημαίνει γάρ, ἔφη.

Yes, it does, he said.

Οὐκοῦν καὶ ἄλλοθι, ἔφην, πολλαχοῦ αἰσθανόμεθα, ὅταν

440b βιάζωνταί τινα παρὰ τὸν λογισμὸν ἐπιθυμίαι, λοιδοροῦντά

τε αὑτὸν καὶ θυμούμενον τῷ βιαζομένῳ ἐν αὑτῷ, καὶ ὥσπερ

δυοῖν στασιαζόντοιν σύμμαχον τῷ λόγῳ γιγνόμενον τὸν

θυμὸν τοῦ τοιούτου; ταῖς δ' ἐπιθυμίαις αὐτὸν κοινωνήσαντα,

αἱροῦντος λόγου μὴ δεῖν ἀντιπράττειν, οἶμαί σε οὐκ ἂν

φάναι γενομένου ποτὲ ἐν σαυτῷ τοῦ τοιούτου αἰσθέσθαι,

οἶμαι δ' οὐδ' ἐν ἄλλῳ.

Οὐ μὰ τὸν Δία, ἔφη.

And do we not, said I, on many other occasions observe when his desires constrain a man contrary to his reason that he reviles himself and is angry with that within which masters him and that as it were in a faction of two parties the high spirit of such a man becomes the ally of his reason? But its making common cause with the desires against the reason when reason whispers low Thou must not—that, I think, is a kind of thing you would not affirm ever to have perceived in yourself, nor, I fancy, in anybody else either. No, by heaven, he said.

440c Τί δέ, ἦν δ' ἐγώ, ὅταν τις οἴηται ἀδικεῖν; οὐχ ὅσῳ ἂν

γενναιότερος ᾖ, τοσούτῳ ἧττον δύναται ὀργίζεσθαι καὶ

πεινῶν καὶ ῥιγῶν καὶ ἄλλο ὁτιοῦν τῶν τοιούτων πάσχων

ὑπ' ἐκείνου ὃν ἂν οἴηται δικαίως ταῦτα δρᾶν, καί, ὃ λέγω,

οὐκ ἐθέλει πρὸς τοῦτον αὐτοῦ ἐγείρεσθαι ὁ θυμός;

Again, when a man thinks himself to be in the wrong, is it not true that the nobler he is the less is he capable of anger though suffering hunger and cold and whatsoever else at the hands of him whom he believes to be acting justly therein, and as I say his spirit refuses to be aroused against such a one?

Ἀληθῆ, ἔφη.

True, he said.

Τί δὲ ὅταν ἀδικεῖσθαί τις ἡγῆται; οὐκ ἐν τούτῳ ζεῖ τε

καὶ χαλεπαίνει καὶ συμμαχεῖ τῷ δοκοῦντι δικαίῳ καί, διὰ

τὸ πεινῆν καὶ διὰ τὸ ῥιγοῦν καὶ πάντα τὰ τοιαῦτα πάσχειν,

440d ὑπομένων καὶ νικᾷ καὶ οὐ λήγει τῶν γενναίων, πρὶν ἂν ἢ

διαπράξηται ἢ τελευτήσῃ ἢ ὥσπερ κύων ὑπὸ νομέως ὑπὸ

τοῦ λόγου τοῦ παρ' αὑτῷ ἀνακληθεὶς πραϋνθῇ;

But what when a man believes himself to be wronged, does not his spirit in that case seethe and grow fierce (and also because of his suffering hunger, cold and the like) and make itself the ally of what he judges just, and in noble souls it endures and wins the victory and will not let go until either it achieves its purpose, or death ends all, or, as a dog is called back by a shepherd, it is called back by the reason within and calmed.

Πάνυ μὲν οὖν, ἔφη, ἔοικε τούτῳ ᾧ λέγεις· καίτοι γ' ἐν

τῇ ἡμετέρᾳ πόλει τοὺς ἐπικούρους ὥσπερ κύνας ἐθέμεθα

ὑπηκόους τῶν ἀρχόντων ὥσπερ ποιμένων πόλεως.

Your similitude is perfect, he said, and it confirms our former statements that the helpers are as it were dogs subject to the rulers who are as it were the shepherds of the city.

Καλῶς γάρ, ἦν δ' ἐγώ, νοεῖς ὃ βούλομαι λέγειν. ἀλλ'

ἦ πρὸς τούτῳ καὶ τόδε ἐνθυμῇ;

You apprehend my meaning excellently, said I. But do you also take note of this?

440e Τὸ ποῖον;

Of what?

Ὅτι τοὐναντίον ἢ ἀρτίως ἡμῖν φαίνεται περὶ τοῦ

θυμοειδοῦς. τότε μὲν γὰρ ἐπιθυμητικόν τι αὐτὸ ᾠόμεθα

εἶναι, νῦν δὲ πολλοῦ δεῖν φαμεν, ἀλλὰ πολὺ μᾶλλον

αὐτὸ ἐν τῇ τῆς ψυχῆς στάσει τίθεσθαι τὰ ὅπλα πρὸς τὸ

λογιστικόν.

That what we now think about the spirited element is just the opposite of our recent surmise. For then we supposed it to be a part of the appetitive, but now, far from that, we say that, in the factions of the soul, it much rather marshals itself on the side of the reason.

Παντάπασιν, ἔφη.

By all means, he said.

Ἆρ' οὖν ἕτερον ὂν καὶ τούτου, ἢ λογιστικοῦ τι εἶδος,

ὥστε μὴ τρία ἀλλὰ δύο εἴδη εἶναι ἐν ψυχῇ, λογιστικὸν καὶ

ἐπιθυμητικόν; ἢ καθάπερ ἐν τῇ πόλει συνεῖχεν αὐτὴν τρία

441a ὄντα γένη, χρηματιστικόν, ἐπικουρητικόν, βουλευτικόν, οὕτως

καὶ ἐν ψυχῇ τρίτον τοῦτό ἐστι τὸ θυμοειδές, ἐπίκουρον ὂν

τῷ λογιστικῷ φύσει, ἐὰν μὴ ὑπὸ κακῆς τροφῆς διαφθαρῇ;

Is it then distinct from this too, or is it a form of the rational, so that there are not three but two kinds in the soul, the rational and the appetitive, or just as in the city there were three existing kinds that composed its structure, the moneymakers, the helpers, the counsellors, so also in the soul there exists a third kind, this principle of high spirit, which is the helper of reason by nature unless it is corrupted by evil nurture?

Ἀνάγκη, ἔφη, τρίτον.

We have to assume it as a third, he said.

Ναί, ἦν δ' ἐγώ, ἄν γε τοῦ λογιστικοῦ ἄλλο τι φανῇ,

ὥσπερ τοῦ ἐπιθυμητικοῦ ἐφάνη ἕτερον ὄν.

Yes, said I, provided it shall have been shown to be something different from the rational, as it has been shown to be other than the appetitive.

Ἀλλ' οὐ χαλεπόν, ἔφη, φανῆναι· καὶ γὰρ ἐν τοῖς παιδίοις

τοῦτό γ' ἄν τις ἴδοι, ὅτι θυμοῦ μὲν εὐθὺς γενόμενα μεστά

ἐστι, λογισμοῦ δ' ἔνιοι μὲν ἔμοιγε δοκοῦσιν οὐδέποτε μεταλαμβάνειν,

441b οἱ δὲ πολλοὶ ὀψέ ποτε.

That is not hard to be shown, he said; for that much one can see in children, that they are from their very birth chock-full of rage and high spirit, but as for reason, some of them, to my thinking, never participate in it, and the majority quite late.

Ναὶ μὰ Δί', ἦν δ' ἐγώ, καλῶς γε εἶπες. ἔτι δὲ ἐν τοῖς

θηρίοις ἄν τις ἴδοι ὃ λέγεις, ὅτι οὕτως ἔχει. πρὸς δὲ

τούτοις καὶ ὃ ἄνω που [ἐκεῖ] εἴπομεν, τὸ τοῦ Ὁμήρου

μαρτυρήσει, τὸ—

στῆθος δὲ πλήξας κραδίην ἠνίπαπε μύθῳ·

ἐνταῦθα γὰρ δὴ σαφῶς ὡς ἕτερον ἑτέρῳ ἐπιπλῆττον πεποίηκεν

441c Ὅμηρος τὸ ἀναλογισάμενον περὶ τοῦ βελτίονός τε

καὶ χείρονος τῷ ἀλογίστως θυμουμένῳ.

Yes, by heaven, excellently said, I replied; and further, one could see in animals that what you say is true. And to these instances we may add the testimony of Homer quoted above: He smote his breast and chided thus his heart. Hom. Od. 20.17 For there Homer has clearly represented that in us which has reflected about the better and the worse as rebuking that which feels unreasoning anger as if it were a distinct and different thing.

Κομιδῇ, ἔφη, ὀρθῶς λέγεις.

You are entirely right, he said.

Ταῦτα μὲν ἄρα, ἦν δ' ἐγώ, μόγις διανενεύκαμεν, καὶ

ἡμῖν ἐπιεικῶς ὡμολόγηται τὰ αὐτὰ μὲν ἐν πόλει, τὰ αὐτὰ

δ' ἐν ἑνὸς ἑκάστου τῇ ψυχῇ γένη ἐνεῖναι καὶ ἴσα τὸν

ἀριθμόν.

Through these waters, then, said I, we have with difficulty made our way and we are fairly agreed that the same kinds equal in number are to be found in the state and in the soul of each one of us.

Ἔστι ταῦτα.

That is so.

Οὐκοῦν ἐκεῖνό γε ἤδη ἀναγκαῖον, ὡς πόλις ἦν σοφὴ καὶ

ᾧ, οὕτω καὶ τὸν ἰδιώτην καὶ τούτῳ σοφὸν εἶναι;

Then does not the necessity of our former postulate immediately follow, that as and whereby the state was wise so and thereby is the individual wise?

Τί μήν;

Surely.

441d Καὶ ᾧ δὴ ἀνδρεῖος ἰδιώτης καὶ ὥς, τούτῳ καὶ πόλιν

ἀνδρείαν καὶ οὕτως, καὶ τἆλλα πάντα πρὸς ἀρετὴν ὡσαύτως

ἀμφότερα ἔχειν;

And so whereby and as the individual is brave, thereby and so is the state brave, and that both should have all the other constituents of virtue in the same way?

Ἀνάγκη.

Necessarily.

Καὶ δίκαιον δή, ὦ Γλαύκων, οἶμαι φήσομεν ἄνδρα εἶναι

τῷ αὐτῷ τρόπῳ ᾧπερ καὶ πόλις ἦν δικαία.

Just too, then, Glaucon, I presume we shall say a man is in the same way in which a city was just.

Καὶ τοῦτο πᾶσα ἀνάγκη.

That too is quite inevitable.

Ἀλλ' οὔ πῃ μὴν τοῦτό γε ἐπιλελήσμεθα, ὅτι ἐκείνη γε

τῷ τὸ ἑαυτοῦ ἕκαστον ἐν αὐτῇ πράττειν τριῶν ὄντων γενῶν

δικαία ἦν.

But we surely cannot have forgotten this, that the state was just by reason of each of the three classes found in it fulfilling its own function.

Οὔ μοι δοκοῦμεν, ἔφη, ἐπιλελῆσθαι.

I don’t think we have forgotten, he said.

Μνημονευτέον ἄρα ἡμῖν ὅτι καὶ ἡμῶν ἕκαστος, ὅτου ἂν

441e τὰ αὑτοῦ ἕκαστον τῶν ἐν αὐτῷ πράττῃ, οὗτος δίκαιός τε

ἔσται καὶ τὰ αὑτοῦ πράττων.

We must remember, then, that each of us also in whom the several parts within him perform each their own task—he will be a just man and one who minds his own affair.

Καὶ μάλα, ἦ δ' ὅς, μνημονευτέον.

We must indeed remember, he said.

Οὐκοῦν τῷ μὲν λογιστικῷ ἄρχειν προσήκει, σοφῷ ὄντι

καὶ ἔχοντι τὴν ὑπὲρ ἁπάσης τῆς ψυχῆς προμήθειαν, τῷ δὲ

θυμοειδεῖ ὑπηκόῳ εἶναι καὶ συμμάχῳ τούτου;

Does it not belong to the rational part to rule, being wise and exercising forethought in behalf of the entire soul, and to the principle of high spirit to be subject to this and its ally?

Πάνυ γε.

Assuredly.

Ἆρ' οὖν οὐχ, ὥσπερ ἐλέγομεν, μουσικῆς καὶ γυμναστικῆς

κρᾶσις σύμφωνα αὐτὰ ποιήσει, τὸ μὲν ἐπιτείνουσα καὶ

442a τρέφουσα λόγοις τε καλοῖς καὶ μαθήμασιν, τὸ δὲ ἀνιεῖσα

παραμυθουμένη, ἡμεροῦσα ἁρμονίᾳ τε καὶ ῥυθμῷ;

Then is it not, as we said, the blending of music and gymnastics that will render them concordant, intensifying and fostering the one with fair words and teachings and relaxing and soothing and making gentle the other by harmony and rhythm?

Κομιδῇ γε, ἦ δ' ὅς.

Quite so, said he.

Καὶ τούτω δὴ οὕτω τραφέντε καὶ ὡς ἀληθῶς τὰ αὑτῶν

μαθόντε καὶ παιδευθέντε προστήσεσθον τοῦ ἐπιθυμητικοῦ—ὃ

δὴ πλεῖστον τῆς ψυχῆς ἐν ἑκάστῳ ἐστὶ καὶ χρημάτων φύσει

ἀπληστότατον—ὃ τηρήσετον μὴ τῷ πίμπλασθαι τῶν περὶ

τὸ σῶμα καλουμένων ἡδονῶν πολὺ καὶ ἰσχυρὸν γενόμενον

442b οὐκ αὖ τὰ αὑτοῦ πράττῃ, ἀλλὰ καταδουλώσασθαι καὶ ἄρχειν

ἐπιχειρήσῃ ὧν οὐ προσῆκον αὐτῷ γένει, καὶ σύμπαντα τὸν

βίον πάντων ἀνατρέψῃ.

And these two thus reared and having learned and been educated to do their own work in the true sense of the phrase, will preside over the appetitive part which is the mass of the soul in each of us and the most insatiate by nature of wealth. They will keep watch upon it, lest, by being filled and infected with the so-called pleasures associated with the body and so waxing big and strong, it may not keep to its own work but may undertake to enslave and rule over the classes which it is not fitting that it should, and so overturn the entire life of all.

Πάνυ μὲν οὖν, ἔφη.

By all means, he said.

Ἆρ' οὖν, ἦν δ' ἐγώ, καὶ τοὺς ἔξωθεν πολεμίους τούτω ἂν

κάλλιστα φυλαττοίτην ὑπὲρ ἁπάσης τῆς ψυχῆς τε καὶ

τοῦ σώματος, τὸ μὲν βουλευόμενον, τὸ δὲ προπολεμοῦν,

ἑπόμενον [δὲ] τῷ ἄρχοντι καὶ τῇ ἀνδρείᾳ ἐπιτελοῦν τὰ

βουλευθέντα;

Would not these two, then, best keep guard against enemies from without also in behalf of the entire soul and body, the one taking counsel, the other giving battle, attending upon the ruler, and by its courage executing the ruler’s designs?

Ἔστι ταῦτα.

That is so.

Καὶ ἀνδρεῖον δὴ οἶμαι τούτῳ τῷ μέρει καλοῦμεν ἕνα

442c ἕκαστον, ὅταν αὐτοῦ τὸ θυμοειδὲς διασῴζῃ διά τε λυπῶν

καὶ ἡδονῶν τὸ ὑπὸ τῶν λόγων παραγγελθὲν δεινόν τε

καὶ μή.

Brave, too, then, I take it, we call each individual by virtue of this part in him, when, namely, his high spirit preserves in the midst of pains and pleasures the rule handed down by the reason as to what is or is not to be feared.

Ὀρθῶς γ', ἔφη.

Right, he said.

Σοφὸν δέ γε ἐκείνῳ τῷ σμικρῷ μέρει, τῷ ὃ ἦρχέν τ' ἐν

αὐτῷ καὶ ταῦτα παρήγγελλεν, ἔχον αὖ κἀκεῖνο ἐπιστήμην

ἐν αὑτῷ τὴν τοῦ συμφέροντος ἑκάστῳ τε καὶ ὅλῳ τῷ κοινῷ

σφῶν αὐτῶν τριῶν ὄντων.

But wise by that small part that ruled in him and handed down these commands, by its possession in turn within it of the knowledge of what is beneficial for each and for the whole, the community composed of the three.

Πάνυ μὲν οὖν.

By all means.

Τί δέ; σώφρονα οὐ τῇ φιλίᾳ καὶ συμφωνίᾳ τῇ αὐτῶν

τούτων, ὅταν τό τε ἄρχον καὶ τὼ ἀρχομένω τὸ λογιστικὸν

442d ὁμοδοξῶσι δεῖν ἄρχειν καὶ μὴ στασιάζωσιν αὐτῷ;

And again, was he not sober by reason of the friendship and concord of these same parts, when, namely, the ruling principle and its two subjects are at one in the belief that the reason ought to rule, and do not raise faction against it?

Σωφροσύνη γοῦν, ἦ δ' ὅς, οὐκ ἄλλο τί ἐστιν ἢ τοῦτο,

πόλεώς τε καὶ ἰδιώτου.

The virtue of soberness certainly, said he, is nothing else than this, whether in a city or an individual.

Ἀλλὰ μὲν δὴ δίκαιός γε, ᾧ πολλάκις λέγομεν, τούτῳ καὶ

οὕτως ἔσται.

But surely, now, a man is just by that which and in the way we have so often described.

Πολλὴ ἀνάγκη.

That is altogether necessary.

Τί οὖν; εἶπον ἐγώ· μή πῃ ἡμῖν ἀπαμβλύνεται ἄλλο τι

δικαιοσύνη δοκεῖν εἶναι ἢ ὅπερ ἐν τῇ πόλει ἐφάνη;

Well then, said I, has our idea of justice in any way lost the edge of its contour so as to look like anything else than precisely what it showed itself to be in the state?

Οὐκ ἔμοιγε, ἔφη, δοκεῖ.

Ὧδε γάρ, ἦν δ' ἐγώ, παντάπασιν ἂν βεβαιωσαίμεθα

442e εἴ τι ἡμῶν ἔτι ἐν τῇ ψυχῇ ἀμφισβητεῖ, τὰ φορτικὰ αὐτῷ

προσφέροντες.

I think not, he said. We might, I said, completely confirm your reply and our own conviction thus, if anything in our minds still disputes our definition—by applying commonplace and vulgar tests to it.

Ποῖα δή;

What are these?

Οἷον εἰ δέοι ἡμᾶς ἀνομολογεῖσθαι περί τε ἐκείνης τῆς

πόλεως καὶ τοῦ ἐκείνῃ ὁμοίως πεφυκότος τε καὶ τεθραμμένου

ἀνδρός, εἰ δοκεῖ ἂν παρακαταθήκην χρυσίου ἢ ἀργυρίου

δεξάμενος ὁ τοιοῦτος ἀποστερῆσαι, τίν' ἂν οἴει οἰηθῆναι

443a τοῦτον αὐτὸ δρᾶσαι μᾶλλον ἢ ὅσοι μὴ τοιοῦτοι;

For example, if an answer were demanded to the question concerning that city and the man whose birth and breeding was in harmony with it, whether we believe that such a man, entrusted with a deposit of gold or silver, would withhold it and embezzle it, who do you suppose would think that he would be more likely so to act than men of a different kind?

Οὐδέν' ἄν, ἔφη.

No one would, he said.

Οὐκοῦν καὶ ἱεροσυλιῶν καὶ κλοπῶν καὶ προδοσιῶν, ἢ

ἰδίᾳ ἑταίρων ἢ δημοσίᾳ πόλεων, ἐκτὸς ἂν οὗτος εἴη;

And would not he be far removed from sacrilege and theft and betrayal of comrades in private life or of the state in public?

ἐκτός.

He would.

Καὶ μὴν οὐδ' ὁπωστιοῦν γ' ἂν ἄπιστος ἢ κατὰ ὅρκους ἢ

κατὰ τὰς ἄλλας ὁμολογίας.

And, moreover, he would not be in any way faithless either in the keeping of his oaths or in other agreements.

Πῶς γὰρ ἄν;

How could he?

Μοιχεῖαί γε μὴν καὶ γονέων ἀμέλειαι καὶ θεῶν ἀθεραπευσίαι

παντὶ ἄλλῳ μᾶλλον ἢ τῷ τοιούτῳ προσήκουσι.

Adultery, surely, and neglect of parents and of the due service of the gods would pertain to anyone rather than to such a man.

Παντὶ μέντοι, ἔφη.

To anyone indeed, he said.

443b Οὐκοῦν τούτων πάντων αἴτιον ὅτι αὐτοῦ τῶν ἐν αὐτῷ

ἕκαστον τὰ αὑτοῦ πράττει ἀρχῆς τε πέρι καὶ τοῦ ἄρχεσθαι;

And is not the cause of this to be found in the fact that each of the principles within him does its own work in the matter of ruling and being ruled?

Τοῦτο μὲν οὖν, καὶ οὐδὲν ἄλλο.

Yes, that and nothing else.

Ἔτι τι οὖν ἕτερον ζητεῖς δικαιοσύνην εἶναι ἢ ταύτην τὴν

δύναμιν ἣ τοὺς τοιούτους ἄνδρας τε παρέχεται καὶ πόλεις;

Do you still, then, look for justice to be anything else than this potency which provides men and cities of this sort?

Μὰ Δία, ἦ δ' ὅς, οὐκ ἔγωγε.

No, by heaven, he said, I do not.

Τέλεον ἄρα ἡμῖν τὸ ἐνύπνιον ἀποτετέλεσται, ὃ ἔφαμεν

ὑποπτεῦσαι ὡς εὐθὺς ἀρχόμενοι τῆς πόλεως οἰκίζειν κατὰ

443c θεόν τινα εἰς ἀρχήν τε καὶ τύπον τινὰ τῆς δικαιοσύνης

κινδυνεύομεν ἐμβεβηκέναι.

Finished, then, is our dream and perfected —the surmise we spoke of, that, by some Providence, at the very beginning of our foundation of the state, we chanced to hit upon the original principle and a sort of type of justice.

Παντάπασιν μὲν οὖν.

Most assuredly.

Τὸ δέ γε ἦν ἄρα, ὦ Γλαύκων—δι' ὃ καὶ ὠφελεῖ—εἴδωλόν

τι τῆς δικαιοσύνης, τὸ τὸν μὲν σκυτοτομικὸν φύσει ὀρθῶς

ἔχειν σκυτοτομεῖν καὶ ἄλλο μηδὲν πράττειν, τὸν δὲ τεκτονικὸν

τεκταίνεσθαι, καὶ τἆλλα δὴ οὕτως.

Φαίνεται.

It really was, it seems, Glaucon, which is why it helps, a sort of adumbration of justice, this principle that it is right for the cobbler by nature to cobble and occupy himself with nothing else, and the carpenter to practice carpentry, and similarly all others.

Τὸ δέ γε ἀληθές, τοιοῦτόν τι ἦν, ὡς ἔοικεν, ἡ δικαιοσύνη

ἀλλ' οὐ περὶ τὴν ἔξω πρᾶξιν τῶν αὑτοῦ, ἀλλὰ περὶ τὴν

443d ἐντός, ὡς ἀληθῶς περὶ ἑαυτὸν καὶ τὰ ἑαυτοῦ, μὴ ἐάσαντα

τἀλλότρια πράττειν ἕκαστον ἐν αὑτῷ μηδὲ πολυπραγμονεῖν

πρὸς ἄλληλα τὰ ἐν τῇ ψυχῇ γένη, ἀλλὰ τῷ ὄντι τὰ οἰκεῖα

εὖ θέμενον καὶ ἄρξαντα αὐτὸν αὑτοῦ καὶ κοσμήσαντα καὶ

φίλον γενόμενον ἑαυτῷ καὶ συναρμόσαντα τρία ὄντα, ὥσπερ

ὅρους τρεῖς ἁρμονίας ἀτεχνῶς, νεάτης τε καὶ ὑπάτης καὶ

μέσης, καὶ εἰ ἄλλα ἄττα μεταξὺ τυγχάνει ὄντα, πάντα ταῦτα

443e συνδήσαντα καὶ παντάπασιν ἕνα γενόμενον ἐκ πολλῶν,

σώφρονα καὶ ἡρμοσμένον, οὕτω δὴ πράττειν ἤδη, ἐάν τι

πράττῃ ἢ περὶ χρημάτων κτῆσιν ἢ περὶ σώματος θεραπείαν

ἢ καὶ πολιτικόν τι ἢ περὶ τὰ ἴδια συμβόλαια, ἐν πᾶσι τούτοις

ἡγούμενον καὶ ὀνομάζοντα δικαίαν μὲν καὶ καλὴν πρᾶξιν

ἣ ἂν ταύτην τὴν ἕξιν σῴζῃ τε καὶ συναπεργάζηται, σοφίαν

δὲ τὴν ἐπιστατοῦσαν ταύτῃ τῇ πράξει ἐπιστήμην, ἄδικον δὲ

444a πρᾶξιν ἣ ἂν ἀεὶ ταύτην λύῃ, ἀμαθίαν δὲ τὴν ταύτῃ αὖ

ἐπιστατοῦσαν δόξαν.

But the truth of the matter was, as it seems, that justice is indeed something of this kind, yet not in regard to the doing of one’s own business externally, but with regard to that which is within and in the true sense concerns one’s self, and the things of one’s self—it means that a man must not suffer the principles in his soul to do each the work of some other and interfere and meddle with one another, but that he should dispose well of what in the true sense of the word is properly his own, and having first attained to self-mastery and beautiful order within himself, and having harmonized these three principles, the notes or intervals of three terms quite literally the lowest, the highest, and the mean, and all others there may be between them, and having linked and bound all three together and made of himself a unit, one man instead of many, self-controlled and in unison, he should then and then only turn to practice if he find aught to do either in the getting of wealth or the tendance of the body or it may be in political action or private business, in all such doings believing and naming the just and honorable action to be that which preserves and helps to produce this condition of soul, and wisdom the science that presides over such conduct; and believing and naming the unjust action to be that which ever tends to overthrow this spiritual constitution, and brutish ignorance, to be the opinion that in turn presides over this.

Παντάπασιν, ἦ δ' ὅς, ὦ Σώκρατες, ἀληθῆ λέγεις.

What you say is entirely true, Socrates.

Εἶεν, ἦν δ' ἐγώ· τὸν μὲν δίκαιον καὶ ἄνδρα καὶ πόλιν

καὶ δικαιοσύνην, ὃ τυγχάνει ἐν αὐτοῖς ὄν, εἰ φαῖμεν

ηὑρηκέναι, οὐκ ἂν πάνυ τι οἶμαι δόξαιμεν ψεύδεσθαι.

Well, said I, if we should affirm that we had found the just man and state and what justice really is in them, I think we should not be much mistaken.

Μὰ Δία οὐ μέντοι, ἔφη.

No indeed, we should not, he said.

Φῶμεν ἄρα;

Shall we affirm it, then?

Φῶμεν.

Let us so affirm.

Ἔστω δή, ἦν δ' ἐγώ· μετὰ γὰρ τοῦτο σκεπτέον οἶμαι

ἀδικίαν.

So be it, then, said I; next after this, I take it, we must consider injustice.

Δῆλον.

Obviously.

444b Οὐκοῦν στάσιν τινὰ αὖ τριῶν ὄντων τούτων δεῖ αὐτὴν

εἶναι καὶ πολυπραγμοσύνην καὶ ἀλλοτριοπραγμοσύνην καὶ

ἐπανάστασιν μέρους τινὸς τῷ ὅλῳ τῆς ψυχῆς, ἵν' ἄρχῃ ἐν

αὐτῇ οὐ προσῆκον, ἀλλὰ τοιούτου ὄντος φύσει οἵου πρέπειν

αὐτῷ δουλεύειν, τῷ δ' οὐ δουλεύειν ἀρχικοῦ γένους ὄντι;

τοιαῦτ' ἄττα οἶμαι φήσομεν καὶ τὴν τούτων ταραχὴν καὶ

πλάνην εἶναι τήν τε ἀδικίαν καὶ ἀκολασίαν καὶ δειλίαν καὶ

ἀμαθίαν καὶ συλλήβδην πᾶσαν κακίαν.

Must not this be a kind of civil war of these three principles, their meddlesomeness and interference with one another’s functions, and the revolt of one part against the whole of the soul that it may hold therein a rule which does not belong to it, since its nature is such that it befits it to serve as a slave to the ruling principle? Something of this sort, I fancy, is what we shall say, and that the confusion of these principles and their straying from their proper course is injustice and licentiousness and cowardice and brutish ignorance and, in general, all turpitude.

Αὐτὰ μὲν οὖν ταῦτα, ἔφη.

Precisely this, he replied.

444c Οὐκοῦν, ἦν δ' ἐγώ, καὶ τὸ ἄδικα πράττειν καὶ τὸ ἀδικεῖν

καὶ αὖ τὸ δίκαια ποιεῖν, ταῦτα πάντα τυγχάνει ὄντα κατάδηλα

ἤδη σαφῶς, εἴπερ καὶ ἡ ἀδικία τε καὶ δικαιοσύνη;

Then, said I, to act unjustly and be unjust and in turn to act justly the meaning of all these terms becomes at once plain and clear, since injustice and justice are so.

Πῶς δή;

How so?

Ὅτι, ἦν δ' ἐγώ, τυγχάνει οὐδὲν διαφέροντα τῶν ὑγιεινῶν

τε καὶ νοσωδῶν, ὡς ἐκεῖνα ἐν σώματι, ταῦτα ἐν ψυχῇ.

Because, said I, these are in the soul what the healthful and the diseaseful are in the body; there is no difference.

Πῇ; ἔφη.

In what respect? he said.

Τὰ μέν που ὑγιεινὰ ὑγίειαν ἐμποιεῖ, τὰ δὲ νοσώδη νόσον.

Healthful things surely engender health and diseaseful disease.

Ναί.

Yes.

Οὐκοῦν καὶ τὸ μὲν δίκαια πράττειν δικαιοσύνην ἐμποιεῖ,

444d τὸ δ' ἄδικα ἀδικίαν;

Then does not doing just acts engender justice and unjust injustice?

Ἀνάγκη.

Of necessity.

Ἔστι δὲ τὸ μὲν ὑγίειαν ποιεῖν τὰ ἐν τῷ σώματι κατὰ

φύσιν καθιστάναι κρατεῖν τε καὶ κρατεῖσθαι ὑπ' ἀλλήλων,

τὸ δὲ νόσον παρὰ φύσιν ἄρχειν τε καὶ ἄρχεσθαι ἄλλο ὑπ'

ἄλλου.

But to produce health is to establish the elements in a body in the natural relation of dominating and being dominated by one another, while to cause disease is to bring it about that one rules or is ruled by the other contrary to nature.

Ἔστι γάρ.

Yes, that is so.

Οὐκοῦν αὖ, ἔφην, τὸ δικαιοσύνην ἐμποιεῖν τὰ ἐν τῇ ψυχῇ

κατὰ φύσιν καθιστάναι κρατεῖν τε καὶ κρατεῖσθαι ὑπ' ἀλλήλων,

τὸ δὲ ἀδικίαν παρὰ φύσιν ἄρχειν τε καὶ ἄρχεσθαι

ἄλλο ὑπ' ἄλλου;

And is it not likewise the production of justice in the soul to establish its principles in the natural relation of controlling and being controlled by one another, while injustice is to cause the one to rule or be ruled by the other contrary to nature?

Κομιδῇ, ἔφη.

Exactly so, he said.

Ἀρετὴ μὲν ἄρα, ὡς ἔοικεν, ὑγίειά τέ τις ἂν εἴη καὶ

444e κάλλος καὶ εὐεξία ψυχῆς, κακία δὲ νόσος τε καὶ αἶσχος καὶ

ἀσθένεια.

Virtue, then, as it seems, would be a kind of health and beauty and good condition of the soul, and vice would be disease, ugliness, and weakness.

Ἔστιν οὕτω.

It is so.

Ἆρ' οὖν οὐ καὶ τὰ μὲν καλὰ ἐπιτηδεύματα εἰς ἀρετῆς

κτῆσιν φέρει, τὰ δ' αἰσχρὰ εἰς κακίας;

Then is it not also true that beautiful and honorable pursuits tend to the winning of virtue and the ugly to vice?

Ἀνάγκη.

Of necessity.

Τὸ δὴ λοιπὸν ἤδη, ὡς ἔοικεν, ἡμῖν ἐστι σκέψασθαι

445a πότερον αὖ λυσιτελεῖ δίκαιά τε πράττειν καὶ καλὰ ἐπιτηδεύειν

καὶ εἶναι δίκαιον, ἐάντε λανθάνῃ ἐάντε μὴ τοιοῦτος

ὤν, ἢ ἀδικεῖν τε καὶ ἄδικον εἶναι, ἐάνπερ μὴ διδῷ δίκην

μηδὲ βελτίων γίγνηται κολαζόμενος.

And now at last, it seems, it remains for us to consider whether it is profitable to do justice and practice honorable pursuits and be just, whether one is known to be such or not, or whether injustice profits, and to be unjust, if only a man escape punishment and is not bettered by chastisement.

Ἀλλ', ἔφη, ὦ Σώκρατες, γελοῖον ἔμοιγε φαίνεται τὸ

σκέμμα γίγνεσθαι ἤδη, εἰ τοῦ μὲν σώματος τῆς φύσεως

διαφθειρομένης δοκεῖ οὐ βιωτὸν εἶναι οὐδὲ μετὰ πάντων

σιτίων τε καὶ ποτῶν καὶ παντὸς πλούτου καὶ πάσης ἀρχῆς,

τῆς δὲ αὐτοῦ τούτου ᾧ ζῶμεν φύσεως ταραττομένης καὶ

445b διαφθειρομένης βιωτὸν ἄρα ἔσται, ἐάνπερ τις ποιῇ ὃ ἂν

βουληθῇ ἄλλο πλὴν τοῦτο ὁπόθεν κακίας μὲν καὶ ἀδικίας

ἀπαλλαγήσεται, δικαιοσύνην δὲ καὶ ἀρετὴν κτήσεται, ἐπειδήπερ

ἐφάνη γε ὄντα ἑκάτερα οἷα ἡμεῖς διεληλύθαμεν.

Nay, Socrates, he said, I think that from this point on our inquiry becomes an absurdity—if, while life is admittedly intolerable with a ruined constitution of body even though accompanied by all the food and drink and wealth and power in the world, we are yet to be asked to suppose that, when the very nature and constitution of that whereby we live is disordered and corrupted, life is going to be worth living, if a man can only do as he pleases, and pleases to do anything save that which will rid him of evil and injustice and make him possessed of justice and virtue—now that the two have been shown to be as we have described them.

Γελοῖον γάρ, ἦν δ' ἐγώ· ἀλλ' ὅμως ἐπείπερ ἐνταῦθα ἐληλύθαμεν,

ὅσον οἷόν τε σαφέστατα κατιδεῖν ὅτι ταῦτα οὕτως

ἔχει οὐ χρὴ ἀποκάμνειν.

Yes, it is absurd, said I; but nevertheless, now that we have won to this height, we must not grow weary in endeavoring to discover with the utmost possible clearness that these things are so.

Ἥκιστα, νὴ τὸν Δία, ἔφη, πάντων ἀποκμητέον.

That is the last thing in the world we must do, he said.

445c Δεῦρό νυν, ἦν δ' ἐγώ, ἵνα καὶ ἴδῃς ὅσα καὶ εἴδη ἔχει ἡ

κακία, ὡς ἐμοὶ δοκεῖ, ἅ γε δὴ καὶ ἄξια θέας.

Come up here then, said I, that you may see how many are the kinds of evil, I mean those that it is worth while to observe and distinguish.

Ἕπομαι, ἔφη· μόνον λέγε.

I am with you, he said; only do you say on.

Καὶ μήν, ἦν δ' ἐγώ, ὥσπερ ἀπὸ σκοπιᾶς μοι φαίνεται,

ἐπειδὴ ἐνταῦθα ἀναβεβήκαμεν τοῦ λόγου, ἓν μὲν εἶναι εἶδος

τῆς ἀρετῆς, ἄπειρα δὲ τῆς κακίας, τέτταρα δ' ἐν αὐτοῖς ἄττα

ὧν καὶ ἄξιον ἐπιμνησθῆναι.

And truly, said I, now that we have come to this height of argument I seem to see as from a point of outlook that there is one form of excellence, and that the forms of evil are infinite, yet that there are some four among them that it is worth while to take note of.

Πῶς λέγεις; ἔφη.

What do you mean? he said.

Ὅσοι, ἦν δ' ἐγώ, πολιτειῶν τρόποι εἰσὶν εἴδη ἔχοντες,

τοσοῦτοι κινδυνεύουσι καὶ ψυχῆς τρόποι εἶναι.

Πόσοι δή;

As many as are the varieties of political constitutions that constitute specific types, so many, it seems likely, are the characters of soul. How many, pray?

445d Πέντε μέν, ἦν δ' ἐγώ, πολιτειῶν, πέντε δὲ ψυχῆς.

There are five kinds of constitutions, said I, and five kinds of soul.

Λέγε, ἔφη, τίνες.

Tell me what they are, he said.

Λέγω, εἶπον, ὅτι εἷς μὲν οὗτος ὃν ἡμεῖς διεληλύθαμεν

πολιτείας εἴη ἂν τρόπος, ἐπονομασθείη δ' ἂν καὶ διχῇ·

ἐγγενομένου μὲν γὰρ ἀνδρὸς ἑνὸς ἐν τοῖς ἄρχουσι διαφέροντος

βασιλεία ἂν κληθείη, πλειόνων δὲ ἀριστοκρατία.

I tell you, said I, that one way of government would be the constitution that we have just expounded, but the names that might be applied to it are two. If one man of surpassing merit rose among the rulers, it would be denominated royalty; if more than one, aristocracy.

Ἀληθῆ, ἔφη.

True, he said.

Τοῦτο μὲν τοίνυν, ἦν δ' ἐγώ, ἓν εἶδος λέγω· οὔτε γὰρ ἂν

445e πλείους οὔτε εἷς ἐγγενόμενοι κινήσειεν ἂν τῶν ἀξίων λόγου

νόμων τῆς πόλεως, τροφῇ τε καὶ παιδείᾳ χρησάμενος ᾗ

διήλθομεν.

Well, then, I said, this is one of the forms I have in mind. For neither would a number of such men, nor one if he arose among them, alter to any extent worth mentioning the laws of our city—if he preserved the breeding and the education that we have described.

Οὐ γὰρ εἰκός, ἔφη.

It is not likely, he said.